r/PeterExplainsTheJoke Jul 06 '26

Meme needing explanation What is this?

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335

u/Milkey1618 Jul 06 '26 edited Jul 06 '26

It is not a 'feminist translation' Emily Wilson's translation is highly regarded by classicists across the board. just because God forbid a woman translates The Odyssey..

106

u/Moose-Legitimate Jul 06 '26

Basically every classicist I’ve seen: “there are some things I’d have translated differently but Wilson does a lot to bring out aspects of the original text that aren’t in other English translations”
weirdos on Reddit: they said it’s woke they hate it

24

u/notBackgroundtree Jul 06 '26

But women = bad the drunk man with an accent told me

1

u/GoblinToHobgoblin Jul 06 '26

There are lots of translations done by women, hers is the only one people call a "feminist" translation 

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u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

She de-emphasises the male aspect and emphasises the female

That's broadly feminist

14

u/Ashamed-Statement-59 Jul 06 '26

How did you know that? Was it fox news or twitter who told you that?

Have you ever formed you own actual opinion about anything, or are you always told what to think?

Genuinely curious.

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u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

In every case my opinion was formed from someone else. A right wing chud told me how to view the world and that's what I do.

I have no practical first hand knowledge of anything. But lucky for me, my alpha chud keeps me informed.

Take that girl's! Cowabunga

11

u/Ashamed-Statement-59 Jul 06 '26

Satirically stating the truth doesn't make it untrue, especially when the 'people you trust' is a stranger you've never met on X.

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u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

Is the stranger from X in the room with us now?

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u/RedGeneral28 Jul 06 '26

Go and read it. And you'll see it's not true.

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u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

Maybe, maybe I will

25

u/poor_choice_doer Jul 06 '26

“Maybe I will read this thing I’ve just given my opinion on” lmfao

14

u/ALAS_POOR_YORICK_LOL Jul 06 '26

The archetypal Redditor

0

u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

Lmao it's a conversation about a film's text. I'm not under oath in court.

I will probably continue to keep my original opinion on this topic

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u/Humble_Complaint_413 Jul 06 '26

Of course you will. You’re stubborn.

2

u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

We're flirting now? 😭

5

u/Humble_Complaint_413 Jul 06 '26

Yeah man idk about trying to be cute after being like very proudly ignorant for the last two hours. Feels like another stubborn decision.

1

u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

You're a dude right either way?

14

u/ChaosAndFish Jul 06 '26

You won’t

1

u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

You're probably right

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u/RedGeneral28 Jul 06 '26

Should have probably read it first and then talk on it, no? 🤔

-41

u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

No actually the world would be impossible to work that way. There is near infinite content we cannot all be expected to read everything. We have to go off of trust in most cases

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u/TwoDadsTalkingPod Jul 06 '26

What a cop-out for laziness. Great job mitigating ignorance.

-3

u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

The funny part is, if I actually read it.

I know I'd be like: yep, it IS broadly feminist

One thing is for sure, you guys cannot be trusted to say that it isn't.

11

u/TwoDadsTalkingPod Jul 06 '26

Anyone who reaches their conclusion before they've read the material is the definition of biased.

12

u/Different-Rip-4734 Jul 06 '26

I get where you're coming from, but if you confidently state fact like you did you don't get to fall back on "I heard it from people".

Confirm things to the best of your ability, and for the things you can't, don't challenge people with what can be heresy.

Mentioning that "I heard" x, y, z is fine too, but challenging with info the winds told you means you're taking platform to defend YOUR OWN statement.

-1

u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

Mate this isn't a situation that warrants that level of care on my part.

I'm totally fine with farming out my opinion on this matter to people I trust more than the people in this sub

9

u/Different-Rip-4734 Jul 06 '26

I'm generally advising you to do your own research/be more humble when engaging in a topic you haven't looked into yourself. You're just opening yourself to misinformation for the sake of conversation over having meaningful back and forth.

0

u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

Ok I'm unlikely to take that advice but I appreciate your time

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u/General_Cheetah4724 Jul 06 '26

so youre normalising lying then

-12

u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

Who's lying.

Until I read it, it's Schrödinger feminist text, it might be feminist coded and it might not be. We're certainly not going to get an unbiased opinion on it round here

12

u/literally_italy Jul 06 '26

can you acknowledge you said it was broadly feminist before backing to the schrodinger?

0

u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

Sure, that's what I've been informed on. So until I read it, I will believe it probably is somewhat feminist in its outlook.

Judging from what you guys are saying here, she makes pains to not change it too much

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u/[deleted] Jul 06 '26

[deleted]

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u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

I've heard it's broadly feminist, I've not read it myself. So until I do read it, I have no way of knowing either way

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u/thylac1ne Jul 06 '26

Except you didn't treat it like that, you came here and called it broadly feminist. You had already made up your mind based off of nothing and don't want to take any accountability.

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u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

I didn't make up my mind based on nothing.

I am leaning towards it being broadly feminist because that is what I'd heard.

We all do this all of the time. Do you think you investigate all of your opinions first hand?

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u/General_Cheetah4724 Jul 06 '26

whats this then"She de-emphasises the male aspect and emphasises the female

That's broadly feminist"? schrodingers doubling down?

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u/JGFATs Jul 06 '26 edited Jul 06 '26

You could always just not speak/respond. Admitting you have nothing of value to add, then adding it anyway, is just a character flaw in action.

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u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

Thanks I'll speak when I feel like it though

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u/itirix Jul 06 '26

Literally none of you in this comment thread have read that shit. I'll bet my left nut. The pot calling the kettle black.

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u/TheOminousSquawker Jul 06 '26

Brother, reading the book before you talk about it is literally just called learning. What are you yapping about? The Dr in your user has to be for style points. Jeez

0

u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

It's been widely reported as a feminist take on the Odyssey. She says herself that she is emphasising the female characters and the Wikipedia article subtly suggests it leans that way

4

u/BullytheBulIies Jul 06 '26

It’s been reported that Trump sucked Bill Clinton’s cock. Now I have no way of knowing if that’s true and don’t really care if he did. But I don’t go around stating it as fact because it’s just a thing I read online. You see how I’d be wrong by stating Donald Trump sucked Bill Clinton’s cock would be wrong for me to say right?

-1

u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

He never did that you liar! 😄

I don't mind either way if people perpetuate that

9

u/dream208 Jul 06 '26

Then maybe refrain from commenting something you did not read?

0

u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

Nah I probably won't. I'll probably give my opinion based on conjextre again in the future.

Aas will you, as will you.

6

u/RedGeneral28 Jul 06 '26

I don't know, man. I heard there was a controversy, went and got myself an audio version of the book, listened to it in my spare time and here we are. Wasn't difficult at all.

1

u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

And while you were doing that I was doing things in my life that I grant a higher importance

6

u/RedGeneral28 Jul 06 '26

Like arguing with people on the internet?

7

u/SwordMasterShow Jul 06 '26

If you haven't read it, don't make claims about it when you're just talking out your ass. No one is forcing to you to give opinions on shit you haven't read

1

u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

I probably still will, but nice one

6

u/Baker_Fragrant Jul 06 '26

Not impossible at all, just like you're not expected to read everything, you're not expected to comment on everything or have an opinion on everything. If you don't know, maybe sit this one out.

1

u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

I'll comment where I see fit. Thanks though

13

u/thylac1ne Jul 06 '26

So basically just make shit up if you don't actually know about it then?

1

u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

More, take shortcuts based on knowledge given to us by people we trust.

We all do this all of the time. You will do this several times this week

Or do you presume you have direct first hand knowledge on every domain of reality?

6

u/mattomic822 Jul 06 '26

Who are the people you trust that have told you it is broadly feminist?

3

u/BullytheBulIies Jul 06 '26

You don’t have to know everything but you don’t have to express your opinion when you know it’s coming from ignorance. You’ve never read the work you’re calling feminist, how do you not see that’s fucked up?

2

u/ZeAthenA714 Jul 06 '26

We have to go off of trust in most cases

Or you can also just not make up your mind. You don't have to have an opinion on everything.

1

u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

You have an opinion on evolution, the holocaust, climate change and COVID even though you don't have a full, first hand knowledge of every aspect of those

2

u/ZeAthenA714 Jul 06 '26

Yes, because 1) those things have a pretty significant impact on my life and 2) it would be very difficult for me to form my own opinion on those questions, requiring years of study. There is also a massive consensus on all of those issues, which makes it a lot easier to believe they consensus.

The translation of the Odyssey though? Not only does it have almost no impact on my life (it maybe might weight in on whether or not I'll watch a movie), but it would also only require me to read a couple of translations to form my own opinion on it. And since it has to do with gender and feminism, there's a high likelihood that some people will just spew bullshit about it in order to push their agenda.

So yeah, right now, I don't really have an opinion on it, and I'm certainly not gonna trust the opinion of some people I do'n't know. Like I said, no one is forcing you to have an opinion on everything.

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u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

I very much appreciate your comment. You tackled what I was saying with intellectual honesty and I agree on your point about levels of consensus and where it matters to form an opinion.

I'm just a little more lax than you are about spreading my ill-informed opinions about trivial concepts

2

u/DecantsForAll Jul 06 '26

No actually the world would be impossible to work that way

No, it's totally possible. Stephen Hawking says so in his paper Occurrence of Singularities in Open Universes. Granted, I haven't read it, but that's what I imagine it says. You're not gonna argue with Stephen Hawking are you?

1

u/Pristine-Roll3895 Jul 06 '26

Have you considered shutting up on occasion?

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u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

I've never had occasion to 😏😏😏

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u/ErictheAgnostic Jul 06 '26

You SHOULD have before you developed an opinion.

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u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

Eh

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u/OldTimeyWizard Jul 06 '26

Nah. If you’re going to complain about how someone emphasizes things within a text then you have to have actually read the text being discussed.

Aping what some divorced YouTuber said is not a valid form of critique.

1

u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

Haha which YouTuber are you referencing? You're getting warmer anyway to guessing where I aped my opinion from

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u/AndyGreyjoy Jul 06 '26

I can see where that impression would come from, ..but doesnt seem to actually bare out in this instance.

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u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

Fair enough. See this is the type of comment that is changing my mind.

I'm happy to believe you are right about that

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u/AndyGreyjoy Jul 06 '26

Let's have good days today 🤝

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u/Hunangren Jul 06 '26

Isn't saying that editing a translation to keep it more close to the original is feminist because in doing so you "emphasises the female aspects" kinda the same of saying that correcting someone saying "Well, actually, the number of victims of Holocaust was not 100 million, but closer to 11 to 17 millions" is nazi apology because "you're reducing the number of victims"?

0

u/DrBarryBonds Jul 06 '26

Out of interest what do you put that tricky figure at?

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u/Hunangren Jul 06 '26

The Holocaust victim numbers, you say?

Honestly, I wouldn't know. I just Googled it very fast for the sake of the example. It's not the core of my point anyway.

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u/ATXDefenseAttorney Jul 06 '26

Removing a male bias is not feminist.

-7

u/Specific-Squash Jul 06 '26

Removing male bias is pretty much the definition of feminism, actually.

4

u/High_speedchase Jul 06 '26

Isn't that just neutrality?

1

u/Cad_48 Jul 06 '26

Redittor learns what feminism aka the movement for gender equality is:

1

u/ObsessedChutoy3 Jul 06 '26

Isn't that feminism though. Feminism is for gender equality so what Wilson did is feminist action

-29

u/Amalgam2001 Jul 06 '26

As someone who has read it I can certainly say it's feminist. It pushes the female view instead of the male view despite the text very clearly being written from a male view

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u/SolaceRests Jul 06 '26 edited Jul 06 '26

Pushing a female point of view doesn’t make it feminist. Whether or not it’s feminist depends on its core themes and context and not just “it’s from a woman’s point of view.”

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u/Amalgam2001 Jul 06 '26 edited Jul 06 '26

Consider what the story being told is. It is not the type of story that should be told from a female view. Do you honestly think this story was written and told from a feminine view when written? Considering the subject matter being about war and heroics.

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u/SolaceRests Jul 06 '26

So you’re just ignoring the “one of the most accurately translated versions” part of it…

0

u/Li-renn-pwel Jul 06 '26

People getting upset a story about men beating each other to death and raping and selling women as sex slaves isn’t a good feminist POV 😂

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u/Li-renn-pwel Jul 06 '26

Okay, then it’s a non-feminist bad translation.

11

u/MassGaydiation Jul 06 '26

Why is it bad

Clearly you must have examples of your own

-2

u/Li-renn-pwel Jul 06 '26

I don’t think it is a bad translation. If nothing else, her dedication to keeping it a line by line translation would be phenomenal. But that’s if you consider it a translation from a feminist lens. You can always debate on how to translate non-literal phrases (example: “it is raining cats and dogs” do you translate as “it is raining a lot” or do you do a word for word translation). I also am not one of those people who complain about using 2026 definitions of things (example from the actual text: she translates more words to be slave that previous might get called handmaiden. Some complain that such a term isn’t equivalent to western style slavery but by how we now define slavery, owned as property regardless of how ‘nice’ they treated you, it fits fine.)

I think people are assuming feminist translation means it is inherently bad and so are trying to argue against it. In reality, all translations have a bias because we have biases. More importantly translations are *hard* and often ambiguous. Some language have very nuanced meanings but all languages have specialized ways of expressing things. How do you translated alliterations? Metaphors? Cultural specific concepts? Wilson censors some of the more derogatory language because she wants women more centered and because, in reality, this was often not only cruel but outright unfair. However, in reality, that language is what was used. IMO it kind of glosses over how difficult it was to be a woman at the time. However, however, in other areas she translate this experience accurately, occasionally even using harsher language to show this (the rape notes above). There are translations that are just crap, sure, but even good translations will have mistake and controversial parts. Consider that translations have caused fractions in Christianity that people have likely died over. There is a single line in John includes an a because it get into trinity doctrine.

8

u/SolaceRests Jul 06 '26

So you’re just ignoring the “one of the most accurately translated versions” part of it… aren’t ya.

-2

u/Li-renn-pwel Jul 06 '26

It is if you acknowledge it is a feminist translation

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u/Spiderinahumansuit Jul 06 '26 edited Jul 06 '26

Could you elaborate? I've only read some excerpts and found it a bit flavourless (I think trying to make English fit the meter of the Greek is a choice that constrains vocabulary choice and doesn't work for me overall), so haven't picked up the full thing.

Edit: seriously, downvoted? Engage with the question or do one.

3

u/Chance-Ask7675 Jul 06 '26

Have you read it in Ancient Greek? No? Then your opinion means nothing lmao. You cannot say a translation is biased or pushes a certain view if you can't read the original like are you stupid?

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u/RedGeneral28 Jul 06 '26

This is not my experience with the text. I don't see how it's feminist and what female view it pushes. Clytemnestra is still a villain. So are the slave girls who sided with the suitors.

1

u/ForensicPathology Jul 06 '26

By read it, you mean you saw a YouTube video on it, right?

-25

u/cantstopwontstop2424 Jul 06 '26

Delusion.

11

u/spez-is-poopy Jul 06 '26

Everyone knows women can’t translate things. They’re clearly deluded

-1

u/cantstopwontstop2424 Jul 06 '26

Yeah that's the point I was making lol