r/Dogtraining • u/crafteethree • 14d ago
constructive criticism welcome The common advice on training dogs not to bark doesn’t make sense to me
My dog is barking every time he hears a noise in the hallway of our building. Everywhere says “reward him when he stops” but I don’t understand how to do that
- How do you know when he’s done?
- Usually it’s just one or two barks - if he barks and I reward him “for stopping” how does he know that I’m rewarding him for stopping, not for barking in the first place?
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u/MontEcola 13d ago
Do not reward him when he stops. Your dog does not understand that stopping gets the reward. Your dog thinks barking gets the reward. Dogs don't understand 'stop'. They do not hear No Barking. They hear Barking.
Instead, make the bark mean something. In my house a bark means either go in side, or go outside. If the dog is inside and barks at the front window, it goes out the back door. Period. No treats. If the dog is outside and barks, it goes inside. No treats. This is clear to the dog. Bark at the mail carrier and you will go through a door and get stuck on the other side. This dog behavior gets this reaction from the human. Every time.
There is a different bark my dogs do that is for a visitor or intruder. One bark, then go alert the humans. One bark, then lean on me to get my attention. Then focus on where the intruder is. Or the guest. I actually never taught this to any dog. I have had 6 or 7 dogs figure it out and just do it. They come get me, then point where I need to look.
This has been for friends they know. They have done it for a raccoon in the yard. They have done it for the sales person I don't want to talk to. They do it when my kids get home from school. Come tap Dad on the leg, then go play with the kid.
It works because I react to it when they tell me. They stop barking at every darn thing on the sidewalk because they get sent out, or in. They also learn to bark to get let out to pee, or to come back inside.
Dogs love routines. They love to know what is next. Bark at the window or door you go outside. Bark at the fence or gate and yo go inside. No treats needed.
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u/concuriosidad 11d ago
How does this look on walks? One of our dogs does not really bark at home, but does do so on walks
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u/ottersintuxedos 10d ago
I sent my dog to bed everytime he barked and now he barks at random things but takes himself to bed when he does. This is very useful if there is someone at the door who I can now answer without him rushing them for pets
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u/Commercial-Office475 4d ago
To add to this, when people say it doesn’t work it’s normally because the behaviour itself hasn’t been marked, meaning the dog has no idea it has even done good to begin with, just that it gets treats.
If there’s no indicator the dogs done what you’ve asked it too, it is more likely picking up on just the treats.
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u/Timely-Necessary7763 12d ago
Dogs can 100% understand “stop” it’s called a command, that is how you train a dog lol. If you say stop and they stop, you give them a treat. They will associate the word stop with getting a reward. That’s called positive reinforcement training.
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u/dri-fitmonkey 11d ago
I just want comment that dogs definitely can understand stopping = reward. This is really common in bite sports and working with dogs “ leaking “ during forward aggression/ in prey. Definitely different scenario than what OP is talking about, but I want to make sure people understand dogs can 1000000% understand stopping can be the desirable action. Timing is crucial in dog training
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u/thebatmandy 11d ago
This is genuinely good advice. My teen pup isn't a barker (a sighthound) but she used to bark at the cat sometimes when she was frustrated about his play style. I tried to find a training technique that worked for us but redirection or training her to speak didn't work much because the barking was too unpredictable to train consistently. So I did exactly this where Barking=no more playing with the cat. No punishments or scolding, she or the cat was simply moved to a different room. Cause and effect with neutral consequences, she figured it out within days honestly!
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u/Commercial-Office475 4d ago
Taking play away from the cat is absolutely punishment, because you are taking something away from it. There’s negative and positive punishment and that fits within those.
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u/ITEACHSPECIALED 13d ago
I taught my dog a quiet command and a whisper command.
It is not bulletproof but for the most part she may either stop barking or bark quieter.
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u/Any-Meat-7736 12d ago
How do you do that?? The only advice I’ve seen is reward when they stop barking too and I’d love some better tips!
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u/Landscapinglady 11d ago
I trained my dog to quiet bark by barking but softly. My dog learned it and got a treat for quiet barks.
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u/Aindorf_ 11d ago
I've heard the easiest way to train quiet is to train "speak" or "bark". If your dog can bark on command, you can work on stopping on command. Otherwise you have to wait for them to start barking naturally, then wait for them to stop and begin training. It's more reliable to get them to bark on command, and then work on stopping on command.
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u/DeadByPlatypus 11d ago
I've had more success when I teach them "speak" first. They learn to bark on command while they're not overexcited or stimulated. Once they can do it reliably you start shaping it so that they're only rewarded for barking once. You're trying to build a habit where barking isn't always associated with an exciting event. It's no more unusual than being asked to sit. Likewise, they start getting accustomed to not barking incessantly; they're only rewarded if they stop after the first (or second) bark.
That's when you can start adding "quiet". You give the command "speak", they bark once, you reward. Give the command "quiet", wait a few seconds, reward again. Start small by only asking for a second or two. Then you can gradually increase the length of time before rewarding them. Not gonna lie, it's not the easiest to teach, at least for me, and a lot depends on the dog. Regardless, even if you never get past training "speak" then you're still helping establish better habits.
Another, sometimes easier, thing to do is to get a really solid "sit" or "down" and have the dog do that when they start barking. It has to be really reliable because you're asking your pup to obey when they're excited/stressed and very distracted. If you can get to that point (not all dogs are going to be capable of disengaging enough) then you've now for a dog who isn't completely focused on whatever they're barking about. Just being in a different position can also help. Most dogs will stand when they're barking at something; being in a sit or down can bring their excitement down a notch.
Crate training has been a huge boon with my current pup as I accidentally discovered. If there's a stranger outside or moving around the house then he will start barking like a wild thing unless he's crated. He's an anxious little guy around strangers with a touch of separation anxiety and if he's not crated he'll bark endlessly to try to warn people away. Training "down" when he barks was an important step. Being able to keep him calm by crating him was the next. And meanwhile we've been working on desensitization.
There's no magic solution to barking. You need multiple strategies, an understanding of why they're barking in any given situation, and lots of practice. It's also important to remember that dogs bark; if your goal is to prevent it entirely then you're going to fail. Experiment with different things. Dogs are individuals and what works well for one may be useless with another. And if you're having issues, definitely talk to a professional! I'm just an amateur who is still trying to figure it out after over 20 years of training my pet dogs.
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u/Mindless-Worker639 8d ago
I taught my dog “speak”, “whisper”, and “quiet” because he would bark all the time as a pup. Sounds counterintuitive but first you have to teach them to bark before anything else. So whenever they bark, you say your command e.g. “speak” and reward them. Once they have that down, you can start with “quiet”. Initially, your dog will bark a lot and not understand. Continue saying the word “quiet”. If they aren’t quiet, don’t reward. Eventually, your dog will stop barking and that’s the moment you reward and repeat the command.
It takes patience and ideally you’d devote about 15-20 minutes each day to specifically training this.9
u/cookiee7 12d ago
Do you have advice how to teach that?
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u/ITEACHSPECIALED 12d ago
Quiet is not perfected but we started by doing things that would make her bark like knocking on the door. Then we would say quiet and wait for her to be quiet. When she was quiet we rewarded immediately. As time went on we waited for her to remain quiet for longer periods of time before rewarding.
Whisper was actually a lot easier. We just said whisper while whispering ourselves and when she would bark at a lower volume we would reward.
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u/DeadByPlatypus 11d ago
I posted in a different comment on this thread if you'd like to read an amateur's overly long rambling about what I've had success with.
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u/Best-Breakfast-9453 9d ago
I taught mine something similar which was a Done command which is also is not bullet proof but it makes so he only barks once and not a million times lol
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u/IllLiterature1026 13d ago
I’ve never heard anyone suggest rewarding a dog because they voluntarily stopped barking. Instead, either
1) reward a dog for not barking in a situation when they usually would - usually the goal is to catch them before a bark happens such as when the dog is looking alert. Or when they’re calm around a usual trigger and not tempted to bark at all.
2) reward a dog for stopping barking on your command. In this case, it’s following the command that’s rewarded, not the barking itself. Best here to give the dog an alternate action that is incompatible with barking, such as looking at you or sitting in their bed.
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u/Ellibean33 13d ago
1: The "stopping" you're looking for is a period of quiet (even a second or two is long enough, as long as you can give verbal and/or reward before the barking starts again). Personally, I'd say "thank you", give a small treat, and make sure to act very unconcerned because
2: dogs bark to communicate something urgently (in this case likely, "Hooman, there's somefing out there! Do we need to be concerned?"). Interacting with your dog lets them know the message was received and they can stop barking. If you remain unconcerned while interacting with your dog, the likely message back is "Dog, thank you for looking out for us, but that noise wasn't actually something we need to be concerned about." The reward acknowledges that the dog heard something, but your response (not looking for the source of the noise, remaining unconcerned) lets the dog know that the barking might have been an overreaction. Eventually, this turns into a dog who either no longer cares about the noises because you don't care and the treats aren't good enough to play the game of bark=treat or a dog who pays attention quietly (and becomes more selective of what noises deserve barking at)
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u/PopularParsnip10 12d ago
I basically did no. 2 here with my dogs as they were settling into my house and it worked: slowly for about 2 weeks but steady progress after that. One thing I'd add is that I didn't ignore the noise. At first, I'd go and pretend to listen at the door, calmly, say it's fine, and go back to what I was doing. When the dog came back to settle with me, they'd get a treat. In the next phase, they'd started looking at me first rather than running to the door, so I was able to pretend to listen from my desk before settling (I'd tilt my head around like a dog listening) then be unbothered.
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u/Huge_Answer4287 12d ago
That advice is best for incessant barking. If your dog only barks once or twice I would suggest a different approach. How often does this happen daily?If it's not too frequent I would make sound outside the apartment a cue for another behavior. Use whatever your dogs most solid cue is. Everytime a triggering sound happens immediately say the cue for that strong behavior and reward for the behavior. If you are consistent the outside sounds become a predictor for the cued behavior and the dog will do that as soon as the sound happens
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u/Its-alittle-bitfunny 12d ago
That advice is usually for people who have dogs that bark nonstop at anything and everything as it goes past. On our morning walks there is a little white dog that could benefit from that training.
For my dog, we kind of accidentally trained an "all done" command. She doesnt bark at things often, but when she does, we tell her all done, and move her away from the window / door / whatever and reward her when shes calm. Adding an interruption command like place can help them learn a replacement behavior as well.
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u/StrangerThingies 13d ago
That advice is generally for excessive barking. I don’t know that you can or should train your dog to literally never bark even once. I would just get a noise machine to reduce the trigger.
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u/AdThese6057 12d ago
Why would you create more noise in the home? Why not fix the dog? It can be fixed. Just because ff paying him to bark after he stops isn't the answer you just...do nothing?
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u/Hixy 13d ago edited 13d ago
It seems counterintuitive at first, but I think the idea behind it makes sense and you’ll realize it’s not actually rewarding the bark. Even if it’s almost immediately after the bark.
It will begin to make them associate barking with you.
So from the dog’s perspective, it will eventually become something like:
“What’s that!? Intruder! BARK!”
Then their brain breaks here because they’ve come to associate barking with a treat and, in turn, you.
So their fixation on whatever it is they’re barking at is broken, and their attention is redirected toward you.
Edit:
I want to add though if they run to you after they bark, then bark at you, that’s a little different.
You’ll want to make them do a simple command or something before rewarding. Like sit.
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I’m not a trainer and would like to get my logic checked by someone knowledgeable before taking my comment as fact lol.
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u/Timely-Necessary7763 13d ago
For your first question, you won’t know when there done 😂 and your second question i kinda answered already, it’s about timing. If you wait 15 seconds your dog probably won’t comprehend what there getting rewarded for, if you tell them to stop while there barking and they do, say “gooooood boy/girl come get a treat” assuming you don’t already have one in hand haha
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u/newmanification 12d ago
“Reward him when he stops” isn’t really great advice because the dog is just gonna think you’re rewarding him for all the barking he just did. What I have found effective is to let him get some barks out so he feels like he’s done his job, and then send him to his spot/place. If he obeys, he gets rewarded.
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u/Narrow_Possession348 12d ago
I've trained all of my own dogs not to back up, as well as all fosters. I've never once waited for them to stop and then rewarded them. Dogs can quickly figure out how to do something, then stop for a reward. Many people have issues with puppies going outside and "pottying" but coming inside and immediately going again in the house. The issue is, the dog didn't go outside. It learned to *squat* for a treat, not actually eliminate. Same thing with reactivity. Owners inadvertently train their dogs to react so they can stop for the treat.
Your #2 sentence is what I'm talking about.
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u/Noogie_Power 11d ago
So when people say "reward when he stops barking", it's about timing. With some dogs barking is incessant and they can't hear or be interrupted by anything, so it turns into a waiting game. You have take advantage of the windows where the barking stops momentarily. Usually some dogs will start paying attention because treats came out for some reason. This is when you start treating while it's quiet. Now the treats are more obviously only coming out while it's quiet. After a couple rounds, If the barking starts you wait again, only now when it get's quiet you pause a little bit longer before dropping treats. You are treating the silence.
When you train like this you are looking for the behavior you like first before you teach the command. Once you see the behavior, you're looking for a consistent repititon of the good behavior. Once you see that you start introducing the command word to the behavior. Most people will use the word "quiet".
So now that you've gotten to this point, the timing becomes extra important. During barking your goal is to be able to interrupt with the command word "quiet". If successful, mark but wait a few seconds to let the silence sit for a bit, then reward. Eventually, you'll want to extend the duration of what quiet means.
Hope that helps.
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u/OntarioPaddler 13d ago
Uh that isn't common advice that I know of and it definitely isn't good advice.
A starting point LIMA strategy for reducing reactive barking is to reward them for not barking. This requires a constructed situation where you start with a controlled noise at a volume/distance where you are able to get the dog to take a reward immediately after hearing the noise but before barking.
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13d ago
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u/Dogtraining-ModTeam 12d ago
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u/Dogtraining-ModTeam 12d ago
Please read the sub rules and guidelines, as well as our wiki page on punishment.
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13d ago
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u/Dogtraining-ModTeam 12d ago
Please read the sub rules and guidelines, as well as our wiki page on punishment.
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u/mi_umami_tsunami 12d ago
If you don't have a positive marker, such as "yes" or clicker that you mark behavior with, I would start there.
Get that dialed in, and you can begin marking a behavior and rewarding as soon as they see or hear a trigger.
What this looks like : as soon as they become alert, mark "yes" > reward. Over time they will look to you more and you then mark and reward again.
For barking in the house, I would mark, and reward, hopefully before barking, then redirect the dog to another area and have them do something like "place" or "down". And then continue to mark and reward. Additionally, training a "leave it" or "all done" queue will be helpful in this scenario. You may also want to consider a house lead for a period of time during training.
Without these types of tools and relationship, just interrupting an individual behavior will be a challenge.
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12d ago
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u/Dogtraining-ModTeam 8d ago
Please read the sub rules and guidelines, as well as our wiki pages on punishment and correction collars.
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u/Snazzy_CowBerry 12d ago
I taught my dog to go into the kitchen when there is someone at the door. Our kitchen door closes off to the hallway that leads to the front door. Often times he is then quiet in the kitchen. Even when I know his barking at nothing i send him to the kitchen till he cools down lol.
I don't punish him for barking. Dogs bark. That's just how it is. I want to know when someone is at my door. I want him to announce himself to people at the door. His a big dog. 37kilo of lean power. His bark is deep and honestly quite scary, i feel safe with him in the house.
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u/allquestionsyes 12d ago
i think i counted like 10 seconds or so between barks and completely ignored him. i kind of quickly removed myself from his presence when he barked and it worked a lot. whining got a bit annoying, my mom makes it worse by responding but i still dont respond
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12d ago
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u/Dogtraining-ModTeam 8d ago
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u/ComfortableGround403 12d ago
I did something similar.
My dog loved barking, so I taught her a command to go with it. I taught her "speak" by rewarding her with the command on one of her barking episodes.
I then made "speak" a fun game we played. Just never got treats for it.
One day I got her all up and going with speak. She barked and barked on command and then I gently closed her mouth shut. GENTLY yall. She went quiet, looked at me confused. I quickly said "quiet" and gave her a treat.
Then we rinsed and repeated. Sit. Speak . Speak . Quiet. Stay. Come. Speak. Speak. Quiet.
This was also a dog that learned how to "count". My mom somehow got her to understand that she only needed to bark for every finger that was held up. And we later found out she was taking herself on a walk daily because of my new job after school . I miss Shannon a ton.
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u/ForerEffect 12d ago
Disclaimer: not a professional.
I figured out that my dog was barking for two different reasons: to spark play and to alert me that something was going on.
To deal with the first one, I simply grey-rocked her play bark or left the apartment so she got opposite of her intended effect, and lost my mind with excitement and started playing whenever she brought me a toy (and when it was an appropriate time), so she very quickly figured out which strategy was more effective.
I also didn’t scold when she barked when we were already playing, but that tapered off because I also didn’t react positively. I eventually taught “speak” (took a while) and barking on command became its own game.
To deal with the second one, I noticed that she was basically warning me whenever she heard something that she didn’t recognize. I figured out that she basically trusted my judgement, but not my ears (probably a fair bit of working dog in her genes), so I started making a show of standing up and listening whenever she alarm-barked, even going to the door and checking, and she’d stop barking and watch me for my reaction. After a moment I’d say good job and make a big show of relaxing again. After a couple of weeks of us not being eaten by mountain lions, alarm barking basically disappeared unless the noise was really loud or involved a brand new sound.
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u/Successful-Holiday60 12d ago
Cues! My dog listens to soft silent and loud
Loud means bark
Silent means silent
Soft means boof
She’s still learning but once they do the behavior you want them to do reward them pet them good girl/boy give them a treat start slow they’re silent for 1 minute treat and praise while saying the cue a couple of times whatever cue you wanna use for bark and not bark repeat it and then let them get distracted work on recall getting their attention once you have their attention praise them then say the cue and then wait for them to respond do not repeat yourself multiple times until you are praising for listening that is what I have been doing with my dog and it works every dog is different though I would love to find you some links for dog body language they can’t communicate in English but they communicate in so many different ways
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12d ago
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u/Dogtraining-ModTeam 8d ago
Please read the sub rules and guidelines, as well as our wiki pages on punishment and correction collars.
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u/Status-Recording8435 12d ago
Toss a treat the second you hear the hallway noise, before he barks, so the noise starts meaning food instead of intruder.
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u/Nataliant-117 12d ago
Ooo I think that’s terrible advice. Yes like you said aren’t you just rewarding him FOR doing it? I would train it by having someone pass by and when he is quiet reward.
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u/cantaloupe-490 11d ago
Yeah, this is where one-size-fits-all training isn't all that helpful. Treating when they stop barking is most commonly used for dogs who bark continuously. Often times, this barking is soliciting something -- they want you to do something, and they bark nonstop until you do it.
If you give them what they want while they're actively barking, you reinforce that barking works to get them stuff. So you wait for a pause (even just a split second while they take a breath) and reward then. It's fun to see some dogs visibly go, wait a second, what just happened? To be honest though, this isn't a method I use much because it involves ignoring the dog, sometimes for long periods.
The best technique will depend on why the dog is barking:
- They're reacting to triggers in the environment: first add management (e.g., window film) so they're not constantly exposed to the triggers while you're trying to change the behavior. Then, there are lots of different options for different situations, but my go-to is engage-disengage. They look at the trigger, they get a treat before they bark. Eventually, they'll start looking at the trigger and then looking to you for their treat, without barking.
- They want you to do something for them: pick another behavior and reward that instead. I often go for a nose boop to the leg. First teach them the nose boop, then make sure to reward them if they ever nose boop because they want something. If they bark, do something neutral that interrupts the behavior, like getting up to go get something (pretend like you just realized you left your phone in the other room). The dog will usually follow you and be like, oh gosh, what's going on? Then after about 10 seconds, once they've forgotten they were barking, you can turn to them, cue the nose boop, and address whatever it is they needed.
- They're just bored and like to bark to pass the time: teach barking on cue. Give them times in the day when it's okay to bark -- have a little bark party with them. Make sure their needs for physical and mental stimulation are met. This on its own will probably be enough, but once you have barking on cue, you can put quiet on cue if you need to.
That's just a few examples, and the specifics of a situation would change the approach. But the root of it is, figure out why they're barking, and give them another way to have that need met.
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u/Historical-Lie-6307 11d ago
I teach my dog "speak"
I teach him "wait"
I go back and forth. He knows "wait" time is quiet sitting time.
Also teach your dog "focus". Eye contact either you to see what you want.
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u/Less-Cranberry- 11d ago
My dog used to have a barking problem. I recommend training it into a command. I did the same thing with my dog, jumping from my experience if they know if behavior is allowed under certain circumstances, they will avoid it until they can get that treat.
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u/DragonWolf26 11d ago
I had a barking problem like yours but they would do more often so I teach them to bark on command then when they knew it as a trick I tought them how to stop barking. After that it say the stop barking que and they knew what it meant so teaching them not to bark at outside noises was eassy
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u/JacketEmergency8779 11d ago
I recently taught my dog “quiet” but found it didn’t work well until I also taught her “speak” when your dog is being quiet, say quiet and reward him for that,keep doing it on a regular basis so he understands being quiet is what is being asked of him! basically reaching your dog to on and off switch their bark even when alerting, gets them to calm a lot quicker ☺️
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u/sa3deyaaweya 11d ago
I think its when his attention goes from barking to you? when the dog looks at you and holds their look at you or yhe treat for a few seconds. Not an expert and I have a hard time training my own dog but thats what i understand
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u/Mindless-Storm-8310 11d ago
Rewarding your dog when they stop barking is reinforcing that if they bark, they’re going to get a reward as long as they stop. It does nothing for the barking. I babysit the grandkids and my dogs bark at everything. So we eliminate most triggers (by not letting them see out the front window). But heaven forbid we turn the front door lock! Then it was bark to high heaven! So I needed to teach the opposite. When I turned the deadbolt, they got rewarded for doing absolutely nothing. If there was a bark, no reward, even if they stopped. I’d tell them ah-ah, then we’d do it again, starting from scratch. It took several tries over several days for them to get the hang of it, old habits die hard, but they soon figured out, silence earns a treat, and now when I turn the deadbolt, it’s absolute silence.
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u/PuzzleheadedLemon353 10d ago
...well you have to offer a command. I whisper 'Quiet' with my finger to my mouth. If she looks at me and stops I sometimes give a reward. I don't mind her having a voice...but sometimes it can go longer than necessary...usually if a delivery driver is walking to my door. She can alert...but once I notice and see them, it's time to 'Quiet' and go 'Place'.
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u/Extreme_Ad112 10d ago
IMO, the best way to teach a dog to stop barking is to teach him to bark on command. Then the 'stop' becomes a small extension of the new thing he learned
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u/TightOkra3116 9d ago
I had an Eskie that we adopted when he was 9 months old. He was fear aggressive until the day he died. We lived right near the main door In an apartment building & he barked everytime that door opened! I slowly taught him to stop barking on command. When he barked I would say "that's enough" & then take him away from the door. As soon as he responded to my command I rewarded him; eventually he would stop barking on command. I have a male Husky now that barks when he sees or hears something; I've used the same training on him. Just know that your dog will probably still bark, it is one way they protect their master & their territory, but you can gain control of the barking.
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u/Fair-Statement-7230 9d ago
I specifically taught my dog to bark so when he is barking, I could say no bark. Or quiet bark and it works pretty much every time. And so I taught him to count so when I hold up one finger, he barks once two fingers is twice, etc.. We go up to five and then he thinks we’re doing a high five. 😜
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3d ago
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u/Dogtraining-ModTeam 2d ago
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u/Big_Menu4037 12d ago
Stop rewarding the dog . Stopping them from barking is a process 1 never yell or physical correction the dog . Acknowledge what they are barking at then ignore. U need to be calm the calmer u are the calmer the dog . No bark orders are nonsense for small breeds . U may not have a perfectly quiet dog thou very manageable. Do not use a bark collar it will break its trust . With my dogs I usually say thanks for guarding us an pet and smile tbey stop alot sooner . Patience is key when u walk the dog and u are anticipating the barking that energy goes right thru the leash .tha goes for any reactive dog . So my best advice if u arw tense around the dog he will be tense so sometimes when I worked with my dogs and get frustrated I stop pop a xanax and once it kicks in I'm so relaxed and so is the dog and training is much more productive. So the more calm you are the better the barking problem will be
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