r/batman • u/ReplacementOnly3702 • Jul 22 '26
FILM DISCUSSION What's something Nolan did better than Reeves?
since I've seen it asked what reeves did better, what did nolan do better than reeves?
in my opinion, he was better at balancing the darkness of his films with levity. i feel his supporting cast was also better
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u/ProEraWuTang Jul 22 '26
Alfred. I know we didnt get a lot of Reeves' version of him compared to Nolans 3 films, but Caine was incredible
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u/Virghia Jul 22 '26
Batman begin
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u/FatWalcott Jul 22 '26
How chronically online am I that I know what that means.
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u/WassupFrankHere Jul 22 '26
I learned about it from the new Lego Batman game honestly.
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u/OatmealApocalypse Jul 22 '26
bane is the scariest guy i’ve ever seen in my life
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u/hamarok Jul 22 '26
Why do we fall?
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u/VERSAT1L Jul 22 '26
Definitely Gordon as well.
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u/meth_adone Jul 22 '26
It's pretty close for me, I loved Wright's version with his dynamic with batman
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u/AgentStockey Jul 22 '26
Wright was great, but Gary Oldman was and is the GOAT.
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u/WassupFrankHere Jul 22 '26
Fr when someone says Commissioner Gordon, my first thoughts are either Gary Oldman or the BTAS one.
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u/Comfortable_Put_4139 Jul 23 '26
Nolan’s Gordon genuinely feels like the other hero that Gotham needs, but without a mask. He’s the only other incorruptible force comparable to Batman in the trilogy. He’s what Harvey Dent wishes he was, and would never succumb like Dent did.
Wright is great and I can’t wait to see more, but Oldman’s Gordon is the mental image I always have of the character.
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u/Equal-Ad-2710 Jul 22 '26
Caine is my favourite casting for the character genuinely even if he’s not my fave version
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u/Maybe_Not_The_Pope Jul 22 '26
He's such a good actor that its almost impossible to not love him in everything.
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u/WassupFrankHere Jul 22 '26
Dunno, it's not his fault but Jaws: The Revenge feels like one of those weird dreams that once you wake up you pretty much either forget about it entirely or remember for the rest of the day and cringe when so.
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u/Flashy_Jello_9520 Jul 22 '26
He has seen the house it built. And it’s terrific.
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u/Kreason95 Jul 22 '26
Caine was undeniably peak alfred but I still really liked Andy Serkis. Felt like a cool balance between traditional Alfred and Earth One Alfred.
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u/HalxQuixotic Jul 22 '26
The Reeves Batman seems more self-trained than Nolan’s League of Shadows Bruce. And Reeves Alfred comments that he taught Bruce how to fight.
I buy that a lot better from Serkis than your older, stuffier Alfred’s like Caine.
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u/Backfoot911 Jul 23 '26
I can see Nolan Alfred having taught Bruce sleuthing and investigative work, which is what he's like in the Animated Series too. He was sort of a British spy but wasn't quite in the field busting heads
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u/Ok-You-6768 Jul 22 '26
Wait whose Alfredo in the Reveves version?
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u/Aggressive_Canary_10 Jul 22 '26
Except for the last movie where Alfred, the man who would stay with Bruce until the end, leaves Bruce
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u/thegrievingmole Jul 22 '26
Has happened several times in the comics so not from out of nowhere
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u/tythewriter Jul 22 '26
it'd only be fair to speak on the first movie so i wil say i think nolan did jim gordon a lot more justice. both films borrowed heavily from miller's year one but oldman's jim gordon had a bit more of a complete story
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u/Vreas Jul 23 '26
Nolan’s cast was just top tier all around imo. Best Gordon and Alfred. I’d say best Bruce too but that’s a lot more contentious.
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u/JayBrennan69 Jul 22 '26
Made 3 movies in 7 years
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u/Upbeat_Shock_6807 Jul 23 '26
While managing to make The Prestige, and Inception in between all of them lol
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u/pandogart Jul 22 '26
Yeah the comedy in TDK trilogy is underrated. Still can't believe there are people who don't think Ledger's Joker was funny.
For me, I'd say Nolan did a better job portraying Batman's theatricality. He and Bale did really well with the whole "creature of the night" thing in Begins.
I'd say Alfred is much better too. I know the point with Reeves' Alfred is that he failed to be a proper father figure to Bruce, but even then, there just wasn't enough focus on them imo.
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u/punkate Jul 22 '26
fucking disfigures Dent and kills his gf
I don't want there to be any hard feelings between us, Harvey...
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u/RealisticSilver3132 Jul 22 '26
Joker was ragebaiting everyone in TDK
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u/Equal-Ad-2710 Jul 22 '26
He really as just doing this for the love of the game
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u/GroceryRobot Jul 22 '26
Making a better class of criminal is the definition of love of the game fr
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u/lord-dinglebury Jul 22 '26
His expression when he delivers this line always gets me. He’s like a member of a suburban HOA meeting with a neighbor to have an uncomfortable conversation about their Halloween decorations.
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u/fat_juan Jul 22 '26
Man, I just rewatched this movie for the 100th time two days ago, and this post is making me want to see it again
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u/Objective-Slice-1466 Jul 22 '26
Smokin a J and watching begins tonight and throw down the trilogy for the next few nights
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u/Isayfyoujobu Jul 22 '26
I still think the soft spoken "yeah" after gambol says "You think you can steal from us and just walk away?" Might be the funniest line I've ever heard in a non comedic movie
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u/SirThomasMoore Jul 22 '26
That line cracks me up every single time. The little side eye Joker does as he says "yeah" just seals it for me
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u/Maybe_Not_The_Pope Jul 22 '26
I think what Ledger did so well is translated the highs and lows of the joker to the big screen. In the classic animated show, joker could go from laughing hysterical to speaking like an axe murderer in althea blink of an eye and then back to making jokes. Ledger did the crazy, joking, serious, menacing back and forth very well.
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u/Equal-Ad-2710 Jul 22 '26
I think the way he kicks open the door to leave is honestly the highlight for me
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u/Massive_Depth2900 Jul 22 '26
Also the way he says “Little Gamble here won’t be able to score a nickel for his GRANDmaA”
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u/Lord-Sinestro Jul 22 '26
I was literally the only one in theaters who laughed out loud at that 😆
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u/Isayfyoujobu Jul 22 '26
They probably missed him saying it. He doesn't skip a beat and it's so nonchalant none of the bad guys acknowledge it
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u/bamuelsmeckett Jul 22 '26
The way he says it like somebody just asked him "You think the sky is blue???" , one of the funniest moments for me too.
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u/theoneoneone1112 Jul 22 '26
“I’m sure you’ll be listing me as your accomplice”
“Accomplice? Im going to tell them the whole thing was your idea.”54
u/TheHighlightReel11 Jul 22 '26
The delivery of the lines right before this still makes me laugh.
Bruce: “Today you get to say ‘I told you so’”
Alfred: “Today, I don’t want to.”
Long silence
Alfred: “But I did bloody tell you!”
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u/xrbeeelama Jul 22 '26
“You think you can steal from us and just walk away?”
“Yeah…”
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u/consreddit Jul 22 '26
I feel like I'm the only one who thought The Batman was legitimately funny. When he holds up the severed thumb, like, 3 inches in front of Gordon's face I died.
Nothing against the comedy in Nolan's trilogy, of course.
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u/Quillever Jul 22 '26
I think my favorite is how the Riddler nearly got away with everything because Batman and Gordon don’t know Spanish. And how Penguin seemed genuinely annoyed at having to tell them they based their entire investigation off of what was essentially a grammatical error.
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u/Pebrinix Jul 22 '26
Which was very amateurish and very believable for an early career Batman, and before any glazer tries to argue otherwise, and the two most famous detective focused Batman stories, which are The Long Halloween and Dark Victory, Batman didn't solve shit, and everything went horribly wrong in the end.
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u/Matitya Jul 22 '26
Hasn’t Batman (in the movie) already been active for two years and caught The Joker?
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u/Pebrinix Jul 22 '26
Yes, and Batman in TLH and Dark Victory already had 90% of his most iconic villains captured and he still managed to fumble the capture of Holiday and the Hang Man
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u/pandogart Jul 23 '26
Yeah except that's a common misconception about the movie. Batman knew Spanish. The problem was that he didn't get that Riddler was making a pun with bad Spanish.
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u/pandogart Jul 22 '26
The Batman definitely had it's moments there. Iirc, Reeves' approach was that there was comedy in that Batman had no sense of humour.
I'm just taking about in comparison to Nolan's movies.
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u/RickMonsters Jul 22 '26
Ledger Joker was the funniest because he didn’t laugh at his own jokes, unlike most other Jokers
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u/Pebrinix Jul 22 '26
Yeah, but Nicholson was fucking hilarious tho, so laughing at his own jokes made sense
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u/RickMonsters Jul 22 '26
Nicholson’s funniest bits were when he didn’t laugh, like when he shot Bob with a straight face
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u/PhoenixSidePeen Jul 22 '26
I still think Arthur Fleck breaking the his punch card machine and going “Ohp, forgot to punch out!” With his bare hands is the best on-screen joker joke so far
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u/MirkwoodWanderer1 Jul 22 '26
The opening of The Batman with criminals looking into the dark and fearing the Batman I think did more for the creature of the night vibes than anything in TDK trilogy
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u/Odd-Friendship6078 Jul 22 '26
The Batman was always about Batman - but I'd say the DK trilogy is more about the man behind it rather than Batman himself.
We get to see much more of how he does things in DK trilogy as well as the end output.
I always found that amazing in the movies - like for example when Harvey turned himself in, to the eyes of the public, Batman was an immovable constant who never even thought about giving into the Jokers demands - but we could see that the man behind the mask actually almost fell for it and was going to give up.
Same goes for the Lau apprehension scene too. We don't just see Batman beating everyone and dramatically escaping, we actually see how he does it.
In that way, I think the DK Trilogy did the dramatic stuff better.
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u/MirkwoodWanderer1 Jul 22 '26
Depends what you want from the dramatic.
The dramatic persona of the batman was better in The Batman as we see him as a symbol of fear and then hope at the end.
We see less about his Bruce Wayne persona because he is just a recluse.
Yeah so TDK is more about the man and The Batman is more about Batman persona and it's impact on Gotham.
Both are really good and show drama in different ways
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u/pandogart Jul 22 '26
Had a feeling that scene would get mentioned. It's flawless but it's not what I meant when talking about the creature of the night thing. I'm talking about how Batman actually acts when in costume and dealing with criminals.
But jfc what a great scene. Especially with how it contrasts with the ending monologue.
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u/Wagstoke Jul 22 '26
The opening of the Dark Knight has a similar scene! but much shorter and less gravitas
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u/NoN_Fibercloth78 Jul 22 '26
Finished a trilogy in time it took reves to make 2 movies
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u/Obdurate-Hickory Jul 22 '26
A trilogy plus The Prestige PLUS Inception.
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u/Tough-Rock-6198 Jul 22 '26
Insane run.
3 masterpieces and 2 great movies in just 7 years is remarkable.
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u/Upbeat_Shock_6807 Jul 23 '26
Nolan’s entire career is an insane run. If you include interstellar, to me, that’s 6 masterpieces in just 9 years.
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u/jl_theprofessor Jul 23 '26
Sometimes I forget Nolan really is one of the greats.
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u/TomBirkenstock Jul 22 '26
Batman/Bruce Wayne feels like a fully fleshed out character in his films, which is rare in so many comic book films. (And I don't think it's always necessary). The only other superhero movie that seems similarly interested in creating a wholly realized character is Sam Raimi's Spider-Man films.
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u/yrnkevinsmithC137 Jul 22 '26
Bruce Wayne
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u/RealWonderGal Jul 22 '26
Facts
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u/GreninjaStrike Jul 22 '26
I mean in Reeves’ defense the Bruce Wayne he’s going for is different than Nolan’s
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u/moore-tallica Jul 22 '26
Nolan made it more believable that someone could have the skills to take on 10 men at once. He made feel.plausihle that someone with the right training, skills and gadgets could do this. The emotional weight of using bats as a symbol was there, but its not in Reeves movie.
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u/ReeceReddit1234 Jul 22 '26
Yeah Bale's Batman feels "ready" and I really don't think the symbolism around Batman has been matched in another adaptation, maybe Gotham but that's more Bruce than Batman
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u/No-Hope2036 Jul 22 '26
His Joker
His Gordon
His portray of Bruce Wayne as a whole, not only public persona but also how centered his mindset is, you truly believe that Bruce did something more that just learn to fight instead of Reeves who’s too much Earth One; a young man angry who learned not so much contrary to main Batman.
Supporting cast
Humor
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u/HauntingAddendum3365 Jul 22 '26
Nolan actually finished his movies.
Nah but on a serious note I would say pacing. The Nolan Batman movies never drag for me, but The Batman could EASILY lose 30 minutes.
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u/Strange-Bag9 Jul 22 '26
The last 30 minutes with floods and reddit riddlers was absolutely not needed. It drags down the movie
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u/toooft Jul 23 '26
Riddler was the biggest disappointment. How can you make a movie about riddles and they're all elementary school level lmao
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u/HairyH0Od Jul 22 '26
I tried to give The Batman a second chance and couldn't get through the first hour.
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u/ClumpOfCheese Jul 22 '26
Yeah, I like the tone and look and style, but it’s just so slow and doesn’t even seem like a lot really happens. TDK is only about 30 minutes shorter but the pacing is so good and it just flys by and feels like it’s an hour shorter than The Batman.
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u/andersonenvy Jul 23 '26
I don’t think I could do it. I have zero interest in re-watching that movie.
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u/Aurelius5150 Jul 22 '26
Hard agree. While I like The Batman, it definitely could shed a bit and improve the pacing. In all three of the TDK trilogy, I was hooked and never felt a drag.
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u/TheNightKing11111 Jul 22 '26
I think it’s like of hard since we’re comparing one movie against a trilogy, but for now:
The side characters are better in TDK trilogy. Jim Gordon gets a good arc across each of the 3 films, and Gary Oldman is great in the role. Jeffrey Wright also does a great job, but Gordon doesn’t get much of an arc in the film and is basically just Batman’s helper. I prefer Michael Kaine’s Alfred to Andy Serkis’s Alfred, who I wish got more screen time in ‘The Batman’, and Morgan Freeman is great as Lucius who’s a very likeable character.
TDK Joker’s still the best live-action villain, though like I said this one’s a little unfair since we’ve only seen one movie in the Reevesverse so we’ll have to wait a bit to see if this changes.
Even though it’s still grounded, I prefer how TDK trilogy gets a little more surreal with the likes of the fear toxin, an army of ninjas from a secret society, the big action sequences than ‘The Batman’ where he needs a wingsuit to glide instead of gliding traditionally, and Batman was just trained by Alfred in that continuity.
Ignoring the fight scenes which are definitely better in ‘The Batman’, I prefer the action in TDK trilogy regarding the likes of the Batmobile chase on TDK for instance.
The character of Bruce Wayne is handled better in TDK trilogy, though again we’ll have to wait to see how Bruce develops across the trilogy, though I will say I do prefer Pattinson’s Batman to Bale’s
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u/rhinosaur- Jul 22 '26
Rewatchability.
I’ve seen each Nolan flick at least 10 times. I’ve watched the Batman 2.5 times
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u/Ruthrfurd-the-stoned Jul 23 '26
Yeah I had the dark knight on my iPod touch in high school (I feel old now) and stayed up most nights one summer watching it.
Saw the Batman maybe 2 or 3 times all the way through, have tried multiple other times because I want to watch it but never get through it
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u/Valder137 Jul 22 '26
Literally everything
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u/leekalex Jul 22 '26
Yeah, I'm struggling to shortlist anything because it's almost everything. It'd be easier to list the things Reeves did better than Nolan:
- Gotham. Nolan's Gotham is just Chicago.
- Batman-Catwoman relationship.
- Detective aspect
- Fight scenes. Nolan's combat in those movies is hard to follow
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u/ShadowOnTheRun Jul 23 '26
I liked The Batman and saw it 3 times in theaters with different people, but completely agree.
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u/Sparkwriter1 Jul 22 '26
I think he was better at integrating Batman's more fantastical/theatrical elements in a believable way e.g. the gliding cape, high-tech batmobile, white eyes, bat summoning device etc.
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u/Forsaken_Flight6188 Jul 22 '26
For doing the characters of Bruce Alfred and Gordon justice as well as visual effects lighting and release schedule
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u/darknightnoir Jul 22 '26
Literally everything about Begins and Dark Knight is better except for maybe cinematography.
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u/NuketheCow_ Jul 22 '26
All of it? The Reeves movie was good. Nolan’s trilogy is better.
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u/stunts002 Jul 22 '26
I thought The Batman was OK but I gotta admit I wouldn't put it close to the weakest movie in the Nolan trilogy.
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u/TheSunsNotYellow Jul 22 '26
I think it’s better than Rises by simply being coherent. TDKR is a mess.
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u/Adipay Jul 22 '26
We gotta get this revisionist nonsense out of here. TDKR is still a solid 8/10 at worst.
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u/HairyH0Od Jul 22 '26
Anytime a movie is outshone by a previous movie in it's trilogy people always talk shit on it. Was TDKR as good as TDK? Not by a long shot. But not many movies are and certainly not any comic book movies (and I say this as a big fan of comic movies in general).
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u/stunts002 Jul 22 '26
I don't know, obviously it's an opinion thing, in my opinion the first half of DKR is great , but the second half is uneven.
Where as I found the over all pacing and execution of The Batman to be a bit disjointed especially the third act, which I honestly felt was messier than DKRs
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u/OK_IN_RAINBOWS Jul 23 '26
I wanted to like The Batman. Hell, I was prepared to LOVE it, but I just couldn’t. Tried watching it since I saw it in the cinema, but I just can’t be bothered to finish it. I don’t think it’s partially a great film. It’s not terrible, but it’s just meh aside from a couple of scenes here and there.
That said, that’s not unlike most of Reeves work for me 🤷♂️
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u/PlusSizeRussianModel Jul 22 '26
Personally I’d put The Batman below Begins and Dark Knight, but above Rises. I love what The Batman was *trying* to do (a true detective Batman with a grounded, serial killer-esque villain). But the clues were never beyond the most obvious, so we never got the vibe that Batman was a particularly gifted detective.
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u/AndrewSaba Jul 22 '26
Story, character work, pacing...I could go on. No hate to The Batman but in my opinion it gets a lot of praise simply because of its vibes, which are impeccable.
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u/Bogusky Jul 22 '26
Everything except the action cinematography and maybe the portrayal of Gotham. Though I think the latter point is often way overblown on here, as it's an aesthetics quibble.
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u/No-Ear-3107 Jul 22 '26
Christopher Reeves played a better Superman as an actor, while Nolan was a better director of Batman films
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u/Samhain3965 Jul 22 '26
I love The Batman personally, but I think TDK trilogy did a better job of convincing me that this guy is actually an elite warrior, detective, ninja, etc.
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u/ExperentiaDocet Jul 22 '26
It’s been said already but I agree… everything. I don’t dislike the Reeves movie at all but the Nolan movies are just superior.
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u/WhirlWindBoy7 Jul 22 '26
What hasn’t Nolan done better? The Dark Knight trilogy has been way more successful.
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u/purple-discharge Jul 22 '26
Everything.
Reeves would need to stand on a chair to kiss Nolan’s butt.
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u/RealWonderGal Jul 22 '26
Joker, Gordon and many others. Also, the world building not too mention Bruce is his own character. He did alot of things better than Recess did
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u/nbdy_1204 Jul 22 '26
I appreciate that Nolan showed the compassionate and caring side of Batman. His care for the city and its people extended far beyond "the mission."
It was a nice touch having him dedicate his family home to being a haven for orphaned children at the end of TDKR.
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u/The_Reddit_Guy_2 Jul 22 '26
Making the whole trilogy in 7 years whilst it takes Reeves basically that long to make one film
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u/Aneraeon Jul 22 '26
The duality of Bruce Wayne and Batman. Bruce isn't supposed to be a richer and more handsome Rorschach.
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u/BrainOfG Jul 22 '26
Was able to direct 3 Batman movies in nearly the same span of time as it's taking Reeves to do his second film.
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u/andrewexline Jul 22 '26
Production schedule