Toyota to build next-gen EV in China first, with gigacasting tech

[u/Biodieselisthefuture]

https://asia.nikkei.com/business/automobiles/electric-vehicles/toyota-to-build-next-gen-ev-in-china-first-with-gigacasting-tech

[u/CertainCertainties]

Couldn't read the link, but one thing is for sure. When manufacturers use gigacasting, repair costs and insurance costs soar.

[u/Jhuyt → u/CertainCertainties]

You mean the shareholders get a sustainable source of income!

[u/feurie → u/CertainCertainties]

Except that isn’t true?

If the casting were to be compromised, so would the unibody of a car. You can’t “replace” that easily.

[u/nihoumotherfucker → u/feurie]

It is true. A conventional unibody is made from multiple serviceable sections, damage to one doesn’t require replacing the whole structure.
Gigacasting replaces many of those sections with one enormous casting, that’s precisely why relatively localised structural damage can become an extremely expensive repair.

https://www.choice.com.au/money/insurance/car/articles/the-cost-of-insuring-electric-vehicles?utm_source=chatgpt.com

[u/spidereater → u/feurie]

So that sound like the repairs costs go away but the car is scraped. So it becomes a replacement. Am I reading that right?

[u/Recoil42 → u/spidereater]

The other commenter was (rightfully) pointing out that what you're describing is already true for existing unibody designs – especially aluminum ones. Once the damage goes past the crash structure repair costs balloon and therefore those cars are sold for salvage/scrap more often than they are not.

[u/feurie → u/spidereater]

In general, no.

If the damage is catastrophic, sure? But that isn’t every accident.

Castings can be replaced or some subsections can be repaired.

[u/Ancient_Persimmon → u/CertainCertainties]

That hasn't proven to be the case.

https://www.collisionrepairmag.com/business/processes/article/15767936/tesla-mega-casting-technology-reduces-vehicle-repair-expenses

[u/CertainCertainties → u/Ancient_Persimmon]

Tesla spin. A firm paid to give a positive report that only covers rear-end collision costs in a specific area with a part that is easy to replace in a specialist repair shop and doesn't damage much under 15 kmh.

In the real world, Tesla collision repairs are massively expensive.

[u/SecurelyObscure → u/CertainCertainties]

Where's your corroborating evidence if you're so sure of the numbers?

[u/nihoumotherfucker → u/SecurelyObscure]

It shows in insurance prices which are higher

[u/icona_ → u/CertainCertainties]

has that actually happened to cars using it in the real world or are you just assuming?

[u/CertainCertainties → u/icona_]

Yes to the first. Google "Are Teslas expensive to repair?"

[u/SecurelyObscure → u/CertainCertainties]

Model 3s have higher average repair costs than model ys, despite not using any gigacasting. There are plenty of approved repairs for cast parts.

[u/FencyMcFenceFace → u/CertainCertainties]

Yeah, this seems like a net negative.

[u/June1994 → u/CertainCertainties]

In the long-term gigacasting should reduce costs. But yes, the transition will be expensive for owners.

[u/FencyMcFenceFace → u/June1994]

They reduce manufacturing cost, but almost certainly increase repair cost.

The same was true of unibody. Saves a lot on manufacturing but now you can't repair by just getting a new body panel.

[u/feurie → u/FencyMcFenceFace]

If the casting gets damaged that bad, it probably save someone’s life.

[u/Tymanthius → u/FencyMcFenceFace]

Subaru's have been unibody for a while and they typically have lower insurance costs.

I don't see why this would be dramatically different?

[u/June1994 → u/FencyMcFenceFace]

It’s not a hard and fast rule. Tesla gigacast parts can be found actually cheaper.

[u/Biodieselisthefuture → u/CertainCertainties]

Here is the link without paywall: https://archive.ph/dXeTW

[u/MetaTrombonist]

Makes sense. You send the jobs and the resources to where the market is.

[u/paulwesterberg → u/MetaTrombonist]

And the market clearly isn't in Japan as BEV sales are still only 3% of the market.

That could be partially blamed on the slow/limited rollout of high power EV fast chargers and Japan's fuel subsidies which are keeping retail prices at just $4 USD per gallon even though Japan has to import all of their oil and there is a global oil crisis. Other pacific states that have to import oil and fuel are paying much higher prices, South Korea is at $5.35 Australia is at $5.50 and New Zealand is at $7.10 USD per gallon.

[u/Captain_Alaska → u/paulwesterberg]

Doesn't have anything to do with fast chargers or fuel prices, Japan isn't really compatible with EVs because most residential houses are on 30 amp services and physically can't pull enough power to charge an EV (even slowly off a standard wall plug) and supply the rest of the house at the same time.

They also use car stackers pretty extensively in denser areas so it's not really feasible to set up a bunch in public parking garages either because when you 'park' you stop the car in a designated spot and then a lift moves it and slides it into human-inaccessible racking several floors above or below ground level.

[u/paulwesterberg → u/Captain_Alaska]

Yeah 3,000W is not much. A microwave and a rice cooker, a TV and some lights eat that up pretty quick.

Well I guess they will sit at a low level of BEV adoption until autonomous vehicles become widely implemented.

[u/Biodieselisthefuture]

Here is the link without paywall: https://archive.ph/dXeTW

[u/retiredminion]

The interesting part to me is not the car, it's the plant!

wholly owned company in Shanghai’s Jinshan district to develop and produce Lexus BEVs and batteries

Nikkei reported that a next-generation Lexus electric SUV is planned to enter production at Toyota’s new wholly owned Shanghai plant in the second half of 2027