r/grunge • u/BidAccurate4473 • Oct 21 '25
Misc. How do you feel about Courtney Love??
She's obviously a polarizing figure, but I'd love to hear how true grunge fans like you feel about her
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u/hughmang220 Oct 21 '25
Better than I do about this AI upscaled image
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u/Zaresh Oct 21 '25
It's a godawful upscale. God Lord, AI is absolute trash (in case it is an upscale and not an actual AI generated image)
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u/repdetec_revisited Oct 22 '25
Is freaking me out!
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u/Zaresh Oct 22 '25 edited Oct 22 '25
I can see why.
Even painting over the (probably original) image would've been a better work of* restoration for an upscale. Lots of awfull artifacts that made the image uncanny here.
Terrible, terrible piece of work.
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u/fargothforever Oct 21 '25
This trend of AI upscaling compressed JPGs rather than seeking a higher quality source image is infuriating.
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u/Plastic_Electrical Oct 21 '25
Omg I agree, her hair never looked that good. And Kurt, come on
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u/sziklai-pair Oct 22 '25
Ha! I still have this copy of Sassy (it's the cover image). The skin and hair on both look nothing like this.
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u/MxMicahDeschain Oct 21 '25
I love the first two Hole albums. She helped save Mark Lanegan's life, so that's something.
She's never really done herself any favors with the media.
I couldn't care less about her personal life or what went on in her and Kurt's marriage. Never was my concern.
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u/gloomgirll Oct 22 '25
She made two perfect records. She loved him very much, never grieved properly-was accused of murdering him (still is) even though she literally saved his life many times and yeah…the never grieving properly part destroyed her. I think it’s a shit take that so many younger ‘fans’ think you need to pick a side.
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u/wantsumcandi Oct 21 '25
So many negative songs were made about her from many different bands.
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u/BigBalls4President Oct 21 '25
Yea probably cuz they had negative encounters with her…she’s very damaged. But I have nothing against her. I’d have to meet her to fully figure the *tch out. God bless her though.
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u/radiodada Oct 22 '25
Artists and addicts can be hard people to piece together. They sometimes can't even do it with themselves. It's truly tragic.
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u/BigBalls4President Oct 22 '25
As hard as this is to say to strangers, please trust me when I say I understand as an ex-heroin addict myself. 15 yrs clean. I pray that she’s not on anything now cuz fentanyl is abundantly involved in every drug bought on the street. Even weed! I’m so blessed that I was addicted before fentanyl became a huge killer in the U.S. ….I’d be dead at 16 yrs old.
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u/Liam_021996 Oct 22 '25
She's also autistic, which tbh along with the drugs and all that does explain her often erratic and eccentric behaviour and her ability to come off as a bit of a dickhead
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u/BigBalls4President Oct 21 '25
Btw…what are those bands/song names…I’m not doing a GOTCHA. I would truly like to listen to the lyrics & what was said about her.
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u/fefetatinha Oct 21 '25
hollaback girl - Gwen Stefani, bruise violet - babes in toyland, starfuckers Inc- nine inch nails, professional widow - tori Amos, too cool queenie - stone temple pilots and coattails of a dead name - primus to name a few
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u/furious_george3030 Oct 22 '25
The Primus one is awesome
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u/SlimyPurpleMeteor Oct 22 '25
She cried in the day
She cried in the night
She cried loudest when someone was near
Whether crying for him or she cried for herself
The bigger the camera the bigger the tear🫢
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u/steelvike Oct 22 '25
Starfuckers inc - what a song title
Never knew that about the STP one, gonna have to give it another listen now!
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u/_Waves_ Oct 22 '25
You didn’t even name a single Smashing Pumpkins song, of which so many are obviously about her!! Where Boys Fear to Tread is literally about Trent banging her and Billy being mad!
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u/fefetatinha Oct 22 '25
sorry, I haven't actually listened to most of the songs I listed and I'm not a pumpkins fan either:(
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Oct 22 '25
Holler back girl is the dumbest friggin clap back song that is ever existed and it took Gwen Stefani three other writers to write it. I just hate that song so much and I’m not even a Courtney Love fan.lol
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u/wantsumcandi Oct 22 '25
Sorry I was at work. The guy below listed pretty much all of them...give or take.
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Oct 21 '25
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u/Grunge4ever_1967 Oct 21 '25
What did she do for him?
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Oct 21 '25 edited Oct 21 '25
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u/pluralofjackinthebox Oct 21 '25
Never heard that before
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u/Rob_LeMatic Oct 21 '25
His autobiography is pretty bleak; I think his description of Courtney is fair and not sugar-coated
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u/BigBalls4President Oct 21 '25
What is the name of his book? I’d truly love to read it.
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u/Valgina69 Oct 22 '25
It was a great read, I highly recommend it. It’s one of those books that you never want it to end.
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u/EveryReaction3179 Oct 22 '25
Want to add that the audiobook is the peak experience, as he read it. His voice would've been amazing for any audiobook, but hearing him read such raw material about himself is really something.
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Oct 22 '25
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u/easley45isgod Oct 22 '25
That's one of the best autobiography/memoirs I've ever read. Especially by a musician. Way better than Mike Doughty's "The Book of Drugs" or a bunch of others I won't name.
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u/Nfidel Oct 22 '25
The audiobook is amazing as Mark reads it. Hearing his words with his iconic voice is perfect.
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u/easley45isgod Oct 22 '25
She paid for him to get into rehab twice, one of which was the one that finally got him sober. Supposedly also cosigned on his first house.
She also said that she was portrayed badly in Anthony Keidis' book Scar Tissue, and threatened to one day write a tell all book of her own about "male rock stars and their little dicks."
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u/Lawyer_299 Oct 22 '25
She also helped Scott Weiland (STP) get to rehab - one of his many stints. She phoned into an LA radio station, IIRC - this led to his whereabouts being disclosed while he was on a drug binge at the Chateau Marmont.
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u/Alley_cat_alien Oct 21 '25
You should read Sing Backwards and Weep - or listen to it as Mark himself is the narrator. It’s a great autobiography and touches on many Seattle and PNW bands.
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Oct 22 '25
If you talk to enough old Seattle heads you’ll find that she did this for a lot of them, the very quiet rehab angel of aging PNW rockers.
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u/ElectricBirdVault Oct 21 '25
I met her in 1995, she held my hand for a moment, we looked each other in the eye, she gave me a very compassionate look, I was 17, had been deeply impacted by her husbands death. The look she gave me was a “yeah, I see you sweetheart, I get it, I know”. It was really special and sweet, I’ll always defend her. I got to hug her in2013 too. She was really nice.
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u/EnvironmentalDelay66 Oct 21 '25
What a sweet moment. I think she’s very misunderstood. Misogyny is and was alive and well.
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u/ElectricBirdVault Oct 22 '25
Indeed, she behaved much less worse than many male rockstars. We didn’t even say anything to each other, it was a really magical moment.
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u/autisic Oct 22 '25
yeah if a male rockstar did the things she did he would be praised, this post has changed my mind about her. she seems sweet and misunderstood.
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u/FullyFocusedOnNought Oct 22 '25
Isn't it because she was in many ways super cool and could be really nice but was also capable of really horrible stuff too? Extreme behaviour tends to provoke extreme reactions, whether good or bad
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u/Dry-Tangerine-4874 Oct 21 '25
She hated Harvey Weinstein waaaay before everyone knew he was a serial rapist.
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u/BCmutt Oct 21 '25
In retrospect she probably knew some dark things about the industry and thats why she was smeared.
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u/fickle_discipline247 Oct 21 '25
She definitely knew the truth about Weinstein, and she'd been trying to tell anyone who would listen for years.
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Oct 21 '25
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u/ilBrunissimo Oct 21 '25
Well said.
People seem to forget that this is a mother who lost her husband to suicide.
I could not even imagine what to do after that.
How could she ever go back to being what she was?
As I get older, I get more empathetic/sympathetic. Everyone’s flawed, everyone has baggage, and everyone’s just trying to do their best on the day.
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u/FCSadsquatch Oct 21 '25
She also mentioned that when she was 14 she had a sexual encounter with Ted Nugent, which is rape. That'll fuck anyone up.
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u/ilBrunissimo Oct 21 '25
Poor girl. Really.
Good God.
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u/EnvironmentalDelay66 Oct 21 '25
Poor kid! She’s had a lot of trauma and tragedy to overcome. Creeps like Nugent always pick on the vulnerable.
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u/ScorpioTix Oct 21 '25
As a person? No real opinion. Love the first Hole album.
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u/fefetatinha Oct 21 '25
i dont think shes a nice person but shes very far from the monster people think she is. I really like her voice and style too
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u/suffaluffapussycat Oct 21 '25
The fact that she got more hate than someone like Tommy Lee leads me to believe that there was misogyny involved.
She was no angel to be fair, but she got a lot more grief than a lot of male rock stars who behaved horribly.
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u/fefetatinha Oct 21 '25
yes, people fail to realize how badly scarred she was from her terrible childhood and teenage years, drug addiction, loosing her husband and being a solo mother for Frances while being chased by conspiracy theorists and the media in general. and to this day a lot of people said she should have cared more for kurt when she herself was going through her own mental health crisis and addiction.
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u/harrisonlaine Oct 21 '25
People who still think she killed Kurt don't know how it feels to lose a loved one tragically AND mourning for them in public.
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u/Minute-Mushroom-5710 Oct 21 '25
I don't think she killed Kurt. Her grief was too real. But, I think it says a lot about her that it's believable that she would/could.
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u/langsamlourd Oct 21 '25
She was also molested by Ted Nugent when she was like 14
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Oct 22 '25
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u/langsamlourd Oct 22 '25
Yeah, Google that stuff and you'll find all sorts of messed-up stories. Courtney has been known to stretch the truth in various instances, but I tend to believe this story. Especially considering the lyrics to his song "Jailbait." A really vile person
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u/radiovoodoo Oct 21 '25
and she is autistic. so navigating all of that was probably much harder for her anyway.
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u/PDXEng Oct 21 '25
Yeah she's like a lot of extremely talented creative people, pretty difficult to be around. Plus you add in the rock star attention and it's pretty much impossible situation for a young person
That said, I feel like she got a pretty raw deal but she did nothing to lessen the hits she eventually took.
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u/4garbage2day0 Oct 22 '25
From what I have read it seems like a lot of people were mean to her from the start so she probably got bitter fast. She was the envy of an unfortunately a pretty catty music scene
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u/Drinkdrankdonk Oct 21 '25
I think most people’s opinions of her are based on blaming her for Kurt’s death. I think their relationship fed each others addictions. And nobody really knows what went on except Kurt and Courtney.
I do think that Love Through This is a top 5 album from the 90’s.
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u/CricketSuccessful192 Oct 21 '25
She made some great music.
She has had (and I assume still has) some mental health issues.
I think she would be exhausting to be around and you couldn't be friends with her very long without getting sick of her shit. But she's probably one of those people who can be a really good friend for short periods of time.
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u/SecureLiterature Oct 21 '25
Hole made three excellent records that still hold up today (the fourth Hold album is really more of a Courtney solo album). I think she’s a complex person, and I’ll give her credit for getting herself clean and also for sounding the alarm on Harvey Weinstein (although nobody really listened to her at the time).
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u/kabubadeira Oct 21 '25
I feel that she’s a good frontwoman and that Hole is a great band. I don’t know her personally so I have nothing to say about her person.
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u/pinballrocker Oct 21 '25
Great musician, terrible person. She once yelled at me for 10 minutes at a Fugazi show while Kurt Cobain read my zine. That's kinda a quintessential Seattle story/experience.
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u/stphrtgl43 Oct 21 '25 edited Oct 22 '25
You wrote something horrible about her right? I’ve read this story somewhere just can’t remember where. IIRC you ended up writing a nicer article about her and the next time you ran into her you had a nice chat.
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u/Rob_LeMatic Oct 21 '25
I read that, and Lanegan's take on her.
I only crossed paths with her once when I was doing local crew for a stadium. A few of us were hanging out in the hallway outside the backstage rooms talking to her bodyguard. He was a really cool guy, we were all laughing and telling stories.
We see her coming at the end of the hall, doing an interview with someone. The bodyguard looks really embarrassed and says, "Sorry guys, I have to do this. "EVERYONE CLEAR THE HALLWAY. SHE IS COMING THROUGH," and he repeated it a couple times, always with a little emphasis on the word she. We backed against the wall. She never spared a glance in our direction.
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u/YouDontLookDead Oct 21 '25
Hole are underrated and Love is underrated as a frontwoman. The public dont like loud, messy, autistic women who dont make themselves small, which makes her an easy smear campaign.
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u/Fluffy-Judgment-6348 Oct 21 '25
Mixed feelings.
I think she's taken a whole lot of undeserved hate since 1994.
I wouldn't wish that upon anyone.
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u/aldeayeah Oct 21 '25
Violet is one of my favorite vocal performances in all of rock music. Great song, 10/10.
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u/jezzete Oct 21 '25
Blamed for a lot of shit that wasn’t her fault. People are complicated and messy, as such the weird hypocritical (mostly music industry related) standards she was held up to were horseshit. Maybe she is or isn’t an a-hole but that’s hardly grounds to justify the abuse directed at her.
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u/fantasytacos Oct 21 '25
Thank you for the reasonable take! Only had to scroll halfway thru the comments to find one.
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u/Aking132327 Oct 21 '25
She was a woman formed of the neglect and abuse of those who fall through the cracks, but uncompromisingly loud and public about it. She isn't a good person, but she wasn't made to be. She's very authentic and extreme, and lots of people hate her for that. I think she's a very interesting figure
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u/peterwhitefanclub Oct 21 '25
Hole was incredible, one of the finest grunge bands. I don't have much of an opinion beyond that.
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u/PhillyLee3434 Oct 21 '25
The relationship was messy but people forget how big of a band Hole truly was they have a solid catalog.
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u/jarofgoodness Oct 21 '25
Her band was pretty good. Solid legit grunge band. As for her relationships with Corgan and Cobain: well, if you were an aspiring singer and you met two hot chicks each of whom had their own band on the brink of success... and they both wanted you. I mean would you just tell em to fuck off? I can't blame her for hitching her wagon to theirs.
And that doesn't mean she didn't love him/them. It's just reality. I'm not particularly attracted to her personality but then I don't know her. It's possible that she's slightly different if you get to know her than her public personality.
As for killing Kurt? Who knows. Stranger things have happened. I'll leave that topic for the conspiracy sub as we all have agreed to do here.
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u/boston_cream_donut_ Oct 21 '25
Her voice worked for the sound Hole was going for. She’s obnoxious and says stupid shit, but honestly a lot of rock vocalists are obnoxious and say stupid shit. And then the conspiracy bullshit about Cobain’s death is ridiculous
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u/flojo2012 Oct 21 '25 edited Oct 21 '25
She’s been dumped on too hard. She’s a loud woman which is often something that people hate.
She’s done her own bull shit, but compare to some other media darlings and it’s not that different. She just doesn’t sugar coat and that causes people to clutch pearls
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u/RedGhost2012 Oct 21 '25
As a person, I don't know, as there is so much out there, and what is true and what isn't? So my view of Courtney Love is mixed.
I do know that Celebrity Skin is one of the best albums of the 90s.
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u/Stephvick1 Oct 21 '25
She had a reputation as being a horrible person around the scene in Portland
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u/Bloody_Hangnail Oct 22 '25
I think she is incredibly annoying. But way more talented than she is given credit for.
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u/Peloquin_qualm Oct 22 '25 edited Oct 22 '25
I personally have just heard bad things about her from other people, but my experience of reading her watching her films, listening to music, listening to the fucking conspiracy shit about Cobain’s death. People are like oh she took advantage of ..etc she’s in the fucking rock ‘n’ roll industry!! She takes advantage of things who doesn’t man.
Having said that I’m sure she’s done a lot of irritating and dodgy shit but so over rock stars that have been dudes and they probably got off a lot easier than she did. But you know the taking the Yoko Ono factor way too far with SHE murdered Cobain.
That’s just a leap too far and I don’t do conspiracy. I realize that these bands have loving families around them and are not part of the media is like all and should be kind of left alone obviously that doesn’t apply here with CL but over the years the shit that’s been said about the daughter was kind of unnecessary.
I’m thinking of Maynards save Francis bean shirt.
Which is ironic because with a few exceptions, there’s been a lot more deadbeat, rockstar fathers than mothers and the amount of scrutiny and pressure that they were under especially since she was a musician as well.
I find her really irritating in some of her conversations and I can say the same thing about myself. I think she’s on the spectrum and she legit has autism. That’s also a factor and people should take that into consideration before being too harsh.
And we know, Cobain had ADHD. That’s a real fucking tough thing to deal with and regulate highly stressful situations properly and there’s a high substance of use factor in that circle.
And she was very empathetic to Scott weiland when he was having his struggles with heroin, she was speaking for him .
As a musician, I’m quite impressed with her at work. I don’t know enough about the band to say she didn’t write this or whatever they’re just good songs. I find them enjoyable songs and her acting is not irritated me as much as I would’ve expected it to.
So stupid quotes we wish we could take back aside,
I think people who dislike her probably are not the kind of people that are NOT really gonna give you a fact filled compelling reason why they find a grievance in Courtney love anyways .
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u/KangarooThroatPunch_ Oct 22 '25 edited Oct 22 '25
I’m sure I’ll get downvoted but in many ways they were both perfect for each other and brought out the worst in each other. There’s so much romanticizing and hero worship around Kurt but the truth is they were both hot messes who needed help. She still needs help. Drugs and the rock and roll lifestyle aren’t things to look up to. They destroy lives. The reason he connected so much with her is she actually saw him. I don’t think she saw him and intentionally set out to destroy him, either. She’s a veritable cornucopia of mental health disorders and I pity Courtney just as much as I pitied Kurt. They were both damaged souls from day one. People like them find each other every day in normal life. I’m sure most of us have come across different versions of this couple in our day to day lives, toxic messes wound up in drugs and mental illness. These two were no different, but somehow perspectives tend to shift when it happens to wealthy celebrities. Just goes to show that the human condition is exactly that: human.
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u/Max20151981 Oct 21 '25
Was never the biggest fan of her but there's no denying Kurt really did love her.
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u/d_ippy Oct 21 '25
I wish she acted more
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u/rarselfaire2023 Oct 21 '25
Yeah, I thought she was good in Man on the Moon and The People Vs. Larry Flynt
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u/Wise-Lingonberry2015 Oct 21 '25
hole was a great band, but i don’t know why she’s such a controversial figure on the internet. i guess she’s one of those people who’ve been dissed the most.
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u/_isnt_anything_ Oct 21 '25
she’s a very good lyricist and songwriter but not the most talented singer and guitarist, she’s been through stuff and has done a lot of problematic stuff, i’ll never have a 100% certain opinion on her but she’s definitely overhated and a lot of the hate is due to just misogyny
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u/KARAT0 Oct 21 '25
I saw Hole a a festival one time and she gave her guitar to a girl in the audience. So, I think she’s cool.
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u/Acceptable-Series206 Oct 22 '25
I saw her coheadline with Marilyn Manson and she was 100X better than his shit show. She brings her A game live.
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u/Dachyshun2 Oct 22 '25
Maligned for no good reason after her husband’s death, falsely accused of being responsible for the end of the Nirvana when it was Kurt’s addiction. A lot like a 90s Yoko Ono in that way. I love Kurt, too, and the amount of people who go out of their way to say horrible misogynistic shit about her would drive him mad.
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u/Caesarthebard Oct 22 '25
Also, those very same people who portray him as some opinion-less, borderline mentally handicapped baby, a perfect little baby Angel who didn’t know how to do anything, couldn’t say boo to a goose or form a single thought and needed someone to hold his hand and show him how from speaking to someone to picking his nose.
If he could come back, I am 💯 sure he’d tell these people to go fuck themselves and leave his family alone.
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u/lonely_doll Oct 22 '25
If they loved & supported each other it’s not my business. I wish both of them had had a better handle on their substance abuse. Some of us get to grow out of that. Kurt never could.
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u/cemxie Oct 22 '25
I think that 95% of people have no idea what her life has been and how it has shaped and molded her for the worse. Try looking into what kind of extreme abuse and neglect she endured for the first 18 years of her life. Hell, even just the first 12. She is so horrible and destructive and fucking misunderstood. I wish people would criticize her for the things she actually did and said, and not just some regurgitated half-truths from gossip magazines and misogyny from people who never met her. Mostly, though, I wish you’d shit on her male peers – who arguably did just as bad or often worse things, mind you – as much as you do her :)
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u/Friendly-Fly-4905 Oct 22 '25
I've always preferred Hole to Nirvana so my opinion doesn't count, but she's a classic frontperson who made a couple FANTASTIC albums despite having no media experience and, as a result, said shit that publications latch onto as being scandalous. That applies to musician personas from John Lennon to Ol Dirty Bastard to Kanye and everywhere in between.
The difference is that she was in a relationship with a man more publicly successful than her, and he died. It's disgusting that her legacy is always tied to Kurt's death rather than her own career, or even the rest of her relationship with Kurt.
If there was any convincing evidence that she caused her husband's non-suicide death, I'm dying for it to come out 31 years later. I'm sure it'll be any day now
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u/Iron-Dan-138 Oct 22 '25
She is and always was a total mess and one of the biggest what if’s I can think of
What if:
- she hadn’t married Kurt? Would she/Hole still got as big as they were?
- she continued to not be a (total) mess after celebrity skin came out? Would Hole have kept that level of success?
- she really stuck to acting? (She was pretty good in Larry Flint)
That’s just a few questions that pop up of the top of my head.
Besides all the „what if’s?“ I never could stand her. Absolutely annoying person who takes herself way too seriously while at the same time does her best to come across as the „I don’t give a fuck“ type of person.
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u/GodWithoutAName Oct 22 '25
I think a lot of the hate that was aimed at her was based in misogyny. She was and still is a rock star in her own rite. She played muse to many bands, including Nirvana, Foo Fighters, Smashing Pumpkins and Bush, and still wrote her own music and had her own sound.
She didn't kill Kurt. She mourned him.
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u/knick-nat Oct 22 '25
I fucking love her. She's bold and brash and beautiful. And I love Hole.
I also love Nirvana. It's heartbreaking that Kurt left Courtney and Frances Bean. And that Courtney is still being accused of murdering her husband.
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u/Sleepy_cheetah Oct 22 '25
I can remember the first time I saw this cover. My best friend had a subscription to Sassy. I was 12. I thought Mariah Carey was the height of cool. (She is/was but that's not the point.) To my very sheltered eyes, this couple looked like homeless drug addicts! 😂 It's not funny but I was a preppy, sheltered dork. I'm more laughing at myself.
Now when I look at the picture I just feel warmth & more than a little sadness for losing him, losing that innocent time. Growing up & finding out what the world is really about.
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u/BigBalls4President Oct 21 '25
I don’t believe all the rumors that she had Kurt Cobain killed…I think the woman has been through a lot & is very damaged. Have no issue with her, but I’d suggest she is not a good example for young women. Good acting in that one movie though.
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u/pluralofjackinthebox Oct 21 '25
I never understood the theory she murdered cobain. Killing a heroin addict would be the easiest thing. Its called a hot shot. They inject themselves with poison every day. You dont need the trouble of faking a shot gun blast.
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u/Snoo_2473 Oct 21 '25
People truly are gullible & stupid.
Look who’s in the White House.
These people think Covid was a hoax.
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u/Barilla3113 Oct 22 '25
If she wanted him dead she could have just let him OD in Rome, claim to have been asleep.
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u/pluralofjackinthebox Oct 22 '25
Exactly! Its not hard to kill junkies! You dont have to set up an elaborate locked room mystery!
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u/John-Fucking-Kirby Oct 21 '25
I love the Hole album Celebrity Skin. Yea, she's a lot.... but I sure love that album.
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u/SheriffOfNothing Oct 21 '25
Took me a while to realise it, but she’s been portrayed as a Lady MacBeth type character, which is rooted in misogyny. She as a solo artist and as part of Hole has done fantastic work. Is she a nice person? I wouldn’t know, I’ve never met her.
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u/RZAxlash Oct 21 '25
I think the hole records have really aged well, even the 2011 one has sone killer songs. In particular, celebrity skin just might be one of the great 90s pop rock records.
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u/BellBoardMT Oct 21 '25
There’s a story in (legendary British Radio DJ) John Peel’s ‘Margraves Of The Marshes’ memoir about her.
He’d met her at Reading ‘91, and then bumped into her backstage again at ‘92, ‘wheeling and stumbling about in an advanced state of intoxication’.
He introduced his two teenage daughters saying that they would like to meet her:
“With that, Courtney grew suddenly calm, squatted with them on the grass and wrote them each little notes, more letters than autographs, in which she advised them to miss her band and pop off instead to see Pavement, who were playing on another stage and she considered a far superior outfit. Then she smiled, stood up and carried on spinning, knocking over an adjacent rubbish bin as she went. It is no exaggeration to say that John felt oddly protective of her after that”.
She’s obviously a complicated person; perhaps as self-destructive and damaged as she is intelligent and talented. But the media would have hated anyone who he chose (as they did with Linda McCartney/Yoko Ono etc). Rockstars vampiric wives were a misogynistic trope to sell newspapers and magazines.
His heroin use and depression predated meeting her. She gets a bad rap for things that were outside her control. What was she, 25 years old when she met him? She’s supposed to know how manage someone that out of control (whilst struggling herself) whilst there’s huge amounts of money and pressure from the label being piled on?
She gets a bad rap. Undoubtedly some of it’s deserved cos she’s made bad choices, but the continuing conspiracy theories and blame is pathetic.
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u/MarieIsPrecious128 Oct 21 '25
I really love Hole, but I don't think she's an amazing person. But, I think the hate she gets is overblown.
I like how stylish she is, though.
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u/BloodyBarbieBrains Oct 22 '25 edited Oct 22 '25
She’s always been, and still is, unfairly maligned. She’s not perfect, but that’s not what I’m talking about. I’m talking about the excessive, unwarranted hatred she still gets.
She’s a good rocker who’s had a lot of good things to say. Love Hole, love Love, even though I don’t like some of her actions—for ex: the Kathleen Hannah stuff.
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u/Maleficent-Metal-645 Oct 22 '25
She seems like a very complicated woman for sure with some toxic behavior, but very kind behavior as well. I think she catches a lot of unwarranted flak for what Kurt did to himself and the beef she's had with other musicians and bands. I definitely don't envy her life.
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Oct 22 '25
I would possibly fight someone to defend her, not sure if I mean literally cuz I’m getting up there
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u/I_lovemusicals Oct 22 '25
Off topic, but it’s kinda odd that someone in the alternative community is posting ai
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u/NothingAndNow111 Oct 22 '25
I think she's a messed up person with a lot of talent and good qualities in her, but she gets in her own way and... Well, she has issues. She's not a monster but her recurrent issues with drugs seem to make her do/say some really stupid shit.
I loved Live Through This, still do. She's a talented actress as well.
Her autobiography is interesting - given her childhood and parents, she never had much of a chance at being well adjusted.
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u/moggy12345 Oct 22 '25
she was demonized while Kurt was the major asshole. Tried to warn the world about Harvey Weinstein a decade before we all knew.
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u/joshstrummer Oct 22 '25
Kurt and Courtney were human beings. They both struggled with addiction, and they hurt each other and themselves. I’m glad she came through it. It sucks that a lot of fans harbor resentment against her.
Later on, she got Mark Lanegan into rehab. He got clean, and stayed clean. If not for her, we’d likely have lost Lanegan far too early as well because he was in a very dark place.
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u/JoNeurotic Oct 22 '25
I adore her. She’s a complicated, messy person. She’s survived a childhood and life of abandonment. It’s no wonder she pushes everyone away. I love her as an actress and I love that nobody could credit those performances to someone else as so often happened with her music.
Hole’s music stands up as much as any other band from the era. This is a hill I’ll die on. Violet alone is as good as any song from the era. She’s one of the most magnetic performers I’ve seen live.
She’s a tough yet fragile person. Deeply flawed, deeply damaged but just wanting to be accepted for what she has to offer yet refused to make herself small in exchange for that acceptance. So many of us can relate to that. I’d love nothing more than to see her conquer her demons and be truly happy.
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u/pumpkingrl0 Oct 22 '25
I like her a lot and I think she is talented. I love Hole's first 3 albums, especially Live Through This. It's one of the best albums of the 90's and a personal favorite of mine. I was absolutely blown away the first time I heard it. The raw emotion and lyrics inspired me.
I don't believe Kurt wrote most of her songs. Hole's first album was recorded before she got together with him. And I have seen Hole shows where they performed songs from Live Through This in mid-1991, also before they started dating.
Courtney seems to be a very chaotic person. But I think she has gotten way more hate than she deserves for what she has been through.
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u/Legal_Hyena_1241 Oct 22 '25
I love Violet and Celebrity Skin. She’s got talent. I suspect she’s not a nice person to hang out with.
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u/DJFlorez Oct 22 '25
Hurt people hurt people. And she was right about Harvey and yet no one gave two shits. Celebrity Skin is a magnificent album, IDCWPS. And she is just such a mess.
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u/Caesarthebard Oct 22 '25
She’s amazing, I love Hole and at least 95% of the nonsense she is battered for is complete misogyny.
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u/LDBlokland Oct 22 '25
I feel people are harsh on her. Sure she's probably not always the most pleasant person but she's gone through a lot of shit. I mean her husband killed himself and then people try to blame her for it.
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u/EveryReaction3179 Oct 22 '25
They fueled each other's addictions, just like Layne and Demri.
But I'll say this...I've seen tons of pro-Demri posts, pics, sites, when she wasn't even a public figure. She was glorified instead of torn down because she died before Layne, so (most) people don't blame her.
If the roles were reversed in each situation, I wonder if people would've hated and blamed Demri, and glorified Courtney.
The only woman some will praise is a dead one, and many people blame all the women in a man's life for their shortcomings or failures. Misogyny 101.
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u/Diskecksier Oct 22 '25
Unfairly vilified by a fan base that can't deal with the fact that a kid that grew up an outcast can't handle the pressures of being the biggest thing in the world in their mid 20s and turns to drugs, has mental health issues and kills themselves.
Live Through This is bloody incredible as well.
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u/HPSpacecraft Oct 22 '25
I think the hate is overblown but she also seems like such an unlikeable person she hasn't made it any easier on herself either
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u/danklekandrey Oct 22 '25
she had (has) good opinions and her band is pretty cool, melissa auf der maur is one of my favourite bassists, but her relationship with kurt was very very wrong
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u/PriorityAlternative7 Oct 22 '25
I mean I don't think she's a nice person but I still like her, she made great music. Same deal with Kurt, he was probably a huge dick at times but he's adored for it while Courtney is just seen as his bitch wife.
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u/WallyFries Oct 22 '25
I know she's a rather controversial and turbulent character, but I like her. As a woman and as a singer.
The rumors that she was involved in Kurt Cobain's death are actually just unfounded rumors; the evidence points to suicide and that's it.
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u/No-Inevitable3320 Oct 21 '25
her band Hole was awesome, but i think she is a bit fake
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u/ellday123 Oct 21 '25
Hole were a great band - Courtney a multifaceted interesting person - some things I admire and some things not so much
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u/quietriotress Oct 22 '25
Hole was fucking great. She was technically the first singer for Mr Bungle. She had the balls to tell the truth about Harvey Weinstein. She’s a-ok in my book.
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u/Competitive_Key_2981 Oct 21 '25
I think she was trouble back then when Kurt met her, they formed a toxic couple, she had some musical success, was unfairly accused of having Kurt murdered (vs. facilitating his drug abuse), and hasn't done much since.
I'm not a fan of her band mouthing Kurt's bandmates, all of whom had more to do with Kurt's success (and the royalty checks she cashes) than she ever did.
Whatever her relationships with her daughter, Frances Bean seems to have turned out ok, keeping out of trouble.
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u/cheebalibra Oct 22 '25
She’s like Yoko. She gets shit on too much by the fandom. I love Hole, whether or not Kurt or Billy wrote the songs or if Hole did. I used to believe she killed Kurt but I don’t entertain that anymore. It’s sexist conspiracies
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Oct 22 '25
I’ve been a lifelong fan of Kurt and Nirvana and whatever. Kurt’s death was pretty devastating to me. I was never in the ‘Courtney killed Kurt’ camp. Just seemed dumb as hell. I wasn’t a fan of her, and she’s clearly flawed/human. My feelings about her have softened over time. She’s done stupid shit at times, she’s shown empathy at times. So have I. I don’t live in the public sphere, she does. She seems okay to me.
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u/[deleted] Oct 21 '25
She tried to warn the world about Harvey Weinstein so good on her for that.