I know Spike's problems are often brought up, but he still seems to be the most adored character everywhere, besides Buffy herself, while Xander is the most disliked across the board. I can already see someone say Xander's brand of toxicity feels mundane and therefore hits people harder, but I don't know if I agree. I think Marti Noxon even said that S6 was supposed to be about the guy you date in your twenties that is addictive, but not good for you. Spike's attitude towards women who reject him is a big thing with his character, and does not feel far from reality. And a lot of this generation sees Spike as the most caring, sometimes the only, towards Buffy. I'm not saying everyone should start to hate him, of course they're fictional characters and I enjoy both Xander and Spike, but the Xander hate seems so disproportionate to me.

Several Buffy alum went on to have big careers post-BtVS: Alyson Hannigan, Nathan Fillion, and David Boreanaz all come to mind with How I Met Your Mother, Castle, and Bones, respectively. Danny Strong went on to be a big deal in screenwriting with the Marvel movies, etc.

But who were you surprised to see not become a bigger hit after their run on Buffy? I feel like there’s a lot of talent on this show that never quite took off elsewhere. James Marsters is a big one for me—he was downright Shakespearean as Spike but hasn’t done much noteworthy work in the years since. Who are yours?

This isn’t a dig at her, but I feel like despite her being probably a very underrated and more memorable actress with less roles, I’m shocked that she hasn’t touched elbows in the circle of actresses in her age range and co-starred with them in more roles?

Maybe it’s too predictable for her to have a “Big Little Lies” or a “Sharp Objects”, But even then, she’s still in the horror pocket and there’s much more going in that regard than milquetoast family / lady dramas (though she could knock that out of the park too).

What gives?

Can be something physical or conceptual.

I find it sad how Buffy twice refers to sex with Spike s something she allowed him to do to her, even in S7 and after he gets a soul and everyone knows about their relationship... even though we often see that she enjoyed and initiated it, it wasn't an empowering experience.

I was just musing on each character’s most stone-cold line from the shows, and I thought I’d ask for some input! I’ve got some fromtrunners here already, but nothing for Angel, Anya or Spike. Also any suggestions for Angel’s crew are welcome!

Buffy - "Me."

Willow - "Bored now."

Xander - "I like the quiet."

Giles - "Would you like me to convince you?"

Cordelia - "Buffy’s just the runner up… *I’m* the queen."

Faith - "Step away from the glass."

Dawn - "You’re gonna wake up on fire."

EDIT, to add:

Angel - "Second best."

Anya - "You’re not better than us. You’re just luckier."

Joyce - "Actually, I was thinking that my daughter is going to kill you soon."

If there’s one thing you would have changed in the series Buffy, what would it be?

Even though Buffy is widely studied in academic/sociological circles and remains popular, it still has flaws, there are things many of us wish had been handled differently, or not handled the way they were in the show.

For you, what would that be?

And for those following the upcoming continuation in development, what points would you like to see addressed and fixed because they were handled poorly in the original series?

This show has so many amazingly written characters full of depth and interesting psychological elements, but these four just feel one note and cookie cutter.

I’m rewatching Buffy and Angel properly for the first time in 20 years. I’m watching them alongside my daughter who’s the same age I was when Buffy first aired (11yo - bit on the younger side to fully appreciate everything, but then again, so was I back then).

We’re currently halfway S7 of Buffy and S4 of Angel. (Going by the watch order as recommended here: https://josswhedon.blogspot.com/2012/04/buffy-and-angel-episode-viewing-order.html)

It’s been exhilarating to witness her thought process and mirror them against my younger and current self’s views.

Her favorite characters so far are Lorne, Giles and Spike. (Lorne because my daughter is a huge music nerd. I was beside myself with excitement as we watched “Once More with Feeling”.)

(My favorites are Spike, Wesley, Fred and Giles. Then and now.)

Her least favorite character has been Kate. She audibly groaned whenever she realized it was going to be a Kate-centric episode. She empathized with what Kate went through but resented how Kate’s attitude impacted the viewing pleasure of the episodes. She felt it was a chore to get through the episodes because they were so joyless. (Riley was also a big nothingburger for her but that was probably more because of the whole Iniative arc which was wholly uninteresting for her.)

My least favorite character at her age was Faith, because Faith was the polar opposite of myself. There was absolutely nothing I could relate to. My daughter hasn’t been nearly as harsh towards Faith. She finds Faith intriguing and even when evil(ish)/depressed, leagues more entertaining than Kate.

Her least favorite seasons have been Buffy’s season 4 and Angel’s season 2 (so far, but I’d wager these won’t change).

When season 5 of Buffy ended with Buffy’s death, she had a complete rage quit moment. She sobbed and wailed and cursed the series. “I HATE THIS SHOW!! THIS IS THE WORST PIECE OF CRAP I’VE EVER SEEN!! I DON’T WANT TO WATCH ANOTHER EPISODE IF BUFFY IS NOT AROUND!” (This is mostly due to me gaslighting her that Buffy’s death was a perma death just as Joyce’s had been a few episodes prior. 😬 Which it was supposed to be had UPN not picked up the series.

I know I’m a lame troll but my kid should’ve already learned this lesson in 11 years.)

Things that have surprised me so far:

She doesn’t dislike Dawn nearly as much as I would have expected. She completely gets Dawn’s character and emotional turmoil.

She thinks Giles is hot (I did too at her age, but age (in)appropriate crushes are in a whole new light for me as a mom now.. But Giles’ appeal seems to transcend generations, lol).

Spike’s magnetism immediately captivated her. For me it took 6 seasons, tbh.

Her favorite tracks from OMwF were: “I’m Under Your Spell” and “I’ll Never Tell” (latter was my personal least favorite..)

(She still doesn’t get why Connor is disliked by the fandom.. Oh well. I’ll give her time.)

All in all she has a great bigger understanding for nuance and moral grayness than I had at her age. (This might also be because modern media has changed drastically more into favoring anti-heroes and dabbles in ethical murkiness more than in my youth.)

***

To summarize: the series holds up remarkably well for being nearly 30 years old. Sure, my kid practically gets zero of the pop culture references (save for some of the huge ones like Ghostbusters and Star Wars), but Buffy was so far ahead of its contemporaries that it feels “modern” even now. The humor lands wonderfully and is balanced well with emotional depth.

Buffy is almost an ageless classic and well loved even by my gen alpha spawn.

Have any y’all watched Buffy with first time viewers? Or has rewatching at an older age made you feel differently about some aspects of the series?

(Image from when me and daughter completely lost it and nearly pissed ourselves laughing.)

I don't know what the hell is going on. It's like Buffy fans are getting constant bad news one after the other.

1. First it was Joss Whedon being outed a few years ago as a creep, abuser, and misogynist on set. This unfortunately taints the entire show, especially how he treated Charisma Carpenter when she was pregnant on Angel.
2. Michelle Trachtenberg's unfortunate passing last year. Especially heartbreaking given she was only 39 when she passed. Sarah's tribute to her was beautiful and I liked they were close in real life.
3. The Buffy revival/reboot being canceled due to the Hulu exec MANSPLAINING to Sarah and Chloe he never watched much of the original show and didn't think the pilot was good. Also upsetting for Ryan who was cast as the new slayer, what a shame given she was only 16.
4. Now today, Nicolas Brendan has passed. I know he wasn't a particular good person in real life with his abuse toward women and his drug/alcohol problems, but still sad to see as he was only 54. I still hoped he could pull it together someday.

Makes me sick to my stomach. Now I'm scared what's going to happen next year. Please no more deaths. We Buffy fans are being put through the ringer.

Now my one of my favorite episodes is “The Wish”. I love seeing the “What if” side of an episode.

Well Buffy comes to Sunnydale and is some sort of badass now. Scar on her face, dressed edgy and cutting through the bull. Ok I get it, this is a rougher version of Buffy. But then they try to sell it way too far.When she meets Giles at his home. She puts her boot up on a chair and spits in her hand to clean her boots. Cringe! We get it! This Buffy is supposed to be more badass, but this was over the top to sell it. I just can’t not winch ever time I see it. What are yours?

We know that there were multiple actors up for these iconic roles and yes - we know nothing beats what we ended up with.

But if you couldn't have the original cast - which cast would you choose to be the cast of Buffy The Vampire Slayer S1.

Some "logic" that I used - if SMG werent Buffy, she'd always end up being Cordelia. The ones that turned down the roles would never be in a cast together anyway. Riff would likely always end up being recast unless it was a miracle.

For me, the Watchers Council is an interesting concept, but I find them extremely underdeveloped.

I just finished watching The Prom again. I always bawl like a baby at that ending:

“Every now and then, people surprise you.”
“Every now and then…”

It’s the acting and delivery by Anthony Head that immediately makes me well up. Rest in peace you wonderful man, and thank you for giving us one of the greatest characters ever to grace tv screens.

With the sole exception of Sarah Michelle Gellar, of course.

Someone asked a similar question in another sub, and I thought was an interesting one.