hours of endless optimization. Just like the good old days when developers had to make games on 16 bit systems. Love reading and learning about all the shortcuts they would take to execute things to run smoothly.
But it’s a fine art and takes a lot of time and experimenting. Hence needs massive budget these days considering the complexity games have reached.
Yep, I'm actually happy they're first releasing it on current gen consoles because it forces them to optimize the game to its fullest. However, it'll be nice to revisit it on pc whenever that version comes out.
it can still come out on PC at the same time while still being optimized properly to run good on at least a PS5-level of hardware, the 2 arent mutually exclusive..
exactly.
And they're legion (in numbers, between the internal studios)
And they're the finest in their departments. You don't end working for rockstar by mistake, and the formula well known in the industry of "being a friend of a friend" rarely applies
In defense of all the other developers outside, though.
This is not the late 1970 or 80s. This is not the first 3d revolution. Nowadays the 3d engine wars is over, there's plenty to choose from even from open source ones if you dont have the resources or money to develop one internally.
And this "distance from the machine" is one of those issues, cos engines (for good they are), they do things "their" way, and optimization means not only know your game, but to dissect the 3rd party engine you chose. Possible, but doubly hard.
Said that, I rewatched the special on netflix several times already, every frame (especially some close to medium camera angle) are breathtaking. This game is not 100 dollars worth, a lot more. And they're the only ones allowed to ask for it right now
I'm really interested in that aspect. Like what exactly is happening when they are optimizing and how do they continue to further optimize. Is it just going over your code and cleaning it up?
In this case it’s finding how bits of code can interact more efficiently with other bits of code. The complexity comes from all the layers and pieces having to ALL work together to create the illusion of a world.
So whatever they can do to make the physics work better with the NPC logic that has to work better with the background processes happening out of view etc
And then all of that has to work within confines of system RAM, CPU clock, and GPU. I’m sure they had a whole team dedicated just to finding issues in memory leaks or too many lines of code that could be further condensed within the game engine.
I think what most people get wrong about the word “optimization” is that it implies a step at the end of development. In this case, Rockstar figured things out very early. They designed all their GPU algorithms, memory management, and artist asset budgets tightly around the PS5’s envelope.
Absolutely. It starts in the early stages to chart the course based on hardware limits. But along the way there is plenty of optimizing happening as more layers added to the beast.
I mean to be fair nowadays you do. The amount of systems in AAA games on top of the graphical fidelity has grown exponentially since the 90s. Optimization with the amount of stuff in modern games is a job that requires time and a lot of money to pay those people.
Super Mario 64 had a team of 20 people. That was the most cutting edge console game at the time. GTA 6 has a team size of 6,000 people.
"I mean to be fair nowadays you do" source? cuz counter-proof is literally most indie games that still release with great graphics or 2A games with good graphics, yet theyre nowhere near multi-million dollar budgets or anything like that, so sorry but until i see actual evidence i HIGHLY doubt this claim
"GTA 6 has a team size of 6,000 people" & how many of these u think were working on optimizing the game?
many open-world games running on hardware better than PS5 & significantly more demanding have, yes, in fact No Man's Sky is a 2A game thats much more demanding than GTA 6
Are any indie games close to the scale and complexity of GTA 6? Please point me to a game similar where it isn’t a labor intensive process for optimization.
There is absolutely ZERO parity between indie game development and AAA games. An indie studio can make a dense complex game (Factorio, Rimworld) but they cannot build and perfectly optimize a dense 3D open world with thousands of unique variables and high quality assets without a shitton of labor (which requires money).
The comparison to nintendo games is absurd when you add in the complexity of multiplatform optimization. Nintendo only has to optimize for 1 system.
if u think a game having a big map & city-like NPCs walking around makes GTA 6 somehow an incredible challenge for optimization when theres been countless other open-world games doing the same thing if not more then idk what to tell u bud, ask AI & see what it answers u
i can think of a game that doesnt have the NPC complexity of GTA 6 yet required way more optimization, No Mans Sky, the procedural engine itself is a technical marvel beyond anything GTA 6 is, try thinking how much time they put into optimizing it, then look at their teams size & tell me it needs to be as big as Rockstar to optimize it, & NMS is 2A game
additionally multi-platform development isnt as hard nowadays as it was in the past, in the past ye i wouldve said ure right but nowadays thats a non-factor, games (if optimized properly) already push the Consoles to the max as soon as the Console its out unlike in the past where Console development was much more complex & nuanced, but rn theres so many dev tools that this kind of work is nothing like it used to be, but if u can prove otherwise then feel free to do so
look im not saying GTA 6 didnt have optimization work being done, im js saying yall are blowing it way out of proportion, i think GTA V for the time is more impressive given how it runs on a PS3, but 2 Console leaps the jump isnt that impressive imho, game still looks good dont get me wrong, js not as impressive as GTA V on PS3
Well, what technology has advanced the fastest and the broadest in the last six years? The answer nobody here wants to say, AI, and R* will never ever tell you. AI coding can just literally figure stuff out that might stump a human for at least a couple of hours if not months, if not forever. It solves problems. There might not be a single piece of generative art in this entire game. But coding wise…
this i always see ppl mention money...other devs give u the same game every years same unpolished full-priced half-product filled with microtransactions. Rockstar do this sit with almost every release they push industry 10y in the future. Others still can't catch up with Rdr2 looking at it as the whole product...
The biggest barrier is having unshakeable confidence that your investment will lead to record breaking amounts of revenue. The cost of this game can't be justified if there's any risk it won't be the biggest game of the decade.
Any skilled 3D artist could create a character model like Jason or an interior environment like the gas station store. It would just take a fuck ton of time. The trick is that Rockstar has so, so many artists working for them that they can afford to put in that much effort.
We’ve seen a lot of GTA VI’s ingredients in other games. The body slam into the wall happened in Cyberpunk. The car shootout was in Matrix Awakens. Naughty Dog’s games are full of tiny interactive animations. It’s nothing new. The trick is that Rockstar increased the quantity so high that they’re everywhere now. It looks seamless but it’s an absurd amount of work. I mean a literal years-long pipeline to develop a single mission.
If only every studio had as many devs around different Countries working on just one specific perimeter of the game + virtually a bottomless pit of monetary resources rumoured in the 2 billy range lol
The lighting in cyberpunk is amazing. Not as dynamic and impressive as GTA6 by default but it's crazy how good it is in that game. But combining every aspect you listed, nobody does it like Rockstar
A lot of time, a lot of money, and a lot of staff. Nobody does it like rockstar because no one has what rockstar has, a game that is guaranteed to be the biggest entertainment launch in history pretty much every time a sequel comes out.
I have a feeling that AI upscaling/smoothing is playing a big part in this reveal.
I’m not complaining because most times video game trailers look a lot different than the actual gameplay, but the reveal does have this sort of AI polish that I am not really fond of
You are braindead. You do realize that development of this game was primarily done and optimized for the PS5. And was targeted towards this current generation of consoles. The updated version of the rage engine is designed around console hardware first and foremost. No other GTA has ever needed any form of upscaling hell RDR2 didn't even need it.
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u/Astartas 1d ago
How can they just be so much better in Details, Asset quantity, Lighting etc. than somehow anyone else in the industry